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[ 12 posts ]

[BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points
Chroma	Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:33 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:06 pm Posts: 9684 Location: Montréal, QC, Canada	Well, got in my second game of the week and got to test out two sets of suggested experimental rules: 1. The Catachan changes I proposed earlier. 2. Significant changes to the Marine They Shall Know No Fear ability. I'll post more tomorrow! _________________ "EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?
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Chroma	Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 4:02 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:06 pm Posts: 9684 Location: Montréal, QC, Canada	Rules Used All experimental rules Catachan proposals found here. They Shall Know No Fear Add: Marines never count as outnumbered, only vastly outnumbered. Change: When a broken Space Marine formation rallies then it receives a number of Blast markers equal to half the number of units. Armies Catachan Insurgency - 2500 points 5 Commissars Catachan Regimental HQ Commissar Snipers Ogryns Catachan Air Cavalry Company - (BTS goal) Commissar Catachan Infantry Company Mortar Section Catachan Veterans Commissar Valkyries Ogryn Platoon Commissar Mortar Platoon Catachan Devils Commissar Sentinel Squadron Thunderbolt Squadron Space Marine Heavy Recon - 2500 points Devastator Detachment Librarian 2 Razorbacks (Lascannons) Whirlwind Detachment Hunter Scout Detachment 1 Supreme Commander Scout Detachment 2 Chaplain Land Speeder Detachment 1 Land Speeder Detachment 2 Predator Detachment (All Annihilators) Vindicator Librarian Warhound Titans - (BTS goal) 2 Warhounds _________________ "EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?
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Chroma	Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 11:41 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:06 pm Posts: 9684 Location: Montréal, QC, Canada	Setup 4x4 table Marines chose edge deployment. Garrisons and Deployment Catachans kept the Catachan Devils and Thunderbolt Squadron in reserve. Marines garrisoned both Scout detachments Land Speeder 2 detachment off of Marine Objective 2, with the Supreme Commander in the rearmost position. ?Land Speeder 1 was garrisoned off of Objective 1. Catachans garrisoned the Ogryn platoon far forward with most of the other formations staggered about, all out of co-mingling range. The rest of deployment is displayed below: _________________ "EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?
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Chroma	Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 11:58 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:06 pm Posts: 9684 Location: Montréal, QC, Canada	Turn 1 No teleports. Strategy roll: Marines The Whirlwinds sustain fire, unleashing a barrage on the Veteran Company, killing 1 Veteran. Land Speeder Detachment 1 then follows up by engaging the Veterans! ?One Speeder is knocked down, but in the end 3 Veterans and 2 Valkyries are left behind by the fleeing Catachans. The Infantry Company sustains fire, its Mortar Section just barely in range of Speeder Detachment 2, and only places 1 Blast marker. Speeder 2 advances on the Ogryn platoon: barbequing one of the abhumans. The Mortar Platoon then sustains fire on the nearby Speeder 2 detachment. ?Shells arc over the hill and swat four Land Speeder out of the air. ?The survivor flees back to the Marine Blitz. The Predator Detachment doubles forward and fires on the Sentinels, the hail of laser fire cuts down two of the walkers, breaking the formation. The Regimental HQ doubles closer to the Predators, firing and laying a Blast marker, and in support range for any other attacks? With a battle cry from their Commissar, the Ogryn charge down the hill to engage the Predators, though they are unable to reach base contact. ?Only one Predator is taken out, via support fire, and only the Commissar and his Ogryn bodyguard are left of the platoon, the other four blown apart by the Predators? so they race back up the hill to hide in the jungle. Scout Detachment 1 mounts up and doubles up against the Catachan Infantry Company, killing a single Guardsman, but in a good position to support. Scout Detachment 2 then moves forward to engage the Infantry Company. ?The Marines lose a single Scout, and the Catachans are routed with the loss of 2 Mortar Teams and 3 Infantry units. Spotting a large banner waving in the air, the Thunderbolt Squadron dives down to strafe Scout Detachment 1, well out of range of the Marine's Hunter. ?The daredevil pilots take out 1 Rhino, 2 Scouts, and the Marine Supreme Commander! ?A great cheer goes up from the Catachans. The Warhound Titans double up to fire on the Air Cavalry units, but the death of the Marine Commander has shaken the crew and they score no hits! The Air Cavalry asks for confirmation of their orders, and then advances on the Warhounds, unleashing 4BP of rockets and a massive volley of other fire. ?Warhound 1 loses 2 Void Shields and takes 1DC damage, while Warhound 2 loses a single Void Shield. The Devastator detachment doubles up and fires on the Air Cav, laying a single Blast marker. End of turn: All Marine units except the sole survivor of Speeder 2 rally while the Ogryn and Sentinels remain broken for the Catachans, and the Air Cavalry fails to remove any Blast markers due to the nearby Titans. _________________ "EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?
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Chroma	Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 12:16 am
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:06 pm Posts: 9684 Location: Montréal, QC, Canada	Turn 2 The Catachan Devils show up, lurking in the ruins near the Whirlwinds? completely safely! ?(Eight units in the formation, and I didn't roll a single "1" for the teleport! Strategy roll: Marines The Predators double over the hill to fire on the Air Cavalry unit, destroying a single Valkyrie, getting themselves into an excellent support position. The Devastators move into position to engage the co-mingled Air Cavalry Company and nearby Infantry Company! (A taste of my own medicine! ?Yuk!) ?The Catachans respond by counter-charging into the Predators and a massive fight erupts! ?The Marines lose only two units: 1 Razorback and 1 Rhino, while the Catachans suffer much heavier losses, losing 3 Valkyries, 2 Mortar Teams, and 2 Infantry? the surviving Guardsmen break and flee. Bursting from hiding, the Catachan Devils engage the Whirlwind detachment, their bombs and booby-traps, and long Catachan knives, wiping out the Marines without a single casualty to the Guard! The Mortar Platoon sustains fire on the closely positioned Predators and Titans, placing a single Blast marker on each formation. The Titans double after the fleeing Air Cavalry, wiping out the broken formation! Heading back to their own lines, Speeder Detachment 1 doubles towards the Devils and places a Blast marker on them. The Thunderbolts come screaming down again to hammer the Scout Titans. ?All three rocket attacks strike home on Warhound 1, dropping its 1 Void Shield and then shattering its knees as it take 2DC damage and comes crashing down, breaking Warhound 2 and causing it to flee to the edge of the battlefield. Another cheer from the Catachans! Scout Detachment 2 seeks revenge by engaging the broken Infantry Company. ?The Catachans are completely destroyed, but a Scout unit and the Chaplain are killed in the fighting. The Regimental HQ doubles forward to catch Speeder Detachment 1 in a cross-fire with the Catachan Devils. ?The Snipers pick off one Speeder's crew and it goes crashing to the ground. The battered survivors of Scout Detachment 1 are too shaken to do anything but regroup and the remove all their Blast markers. End of turn: Again all Marine units except the sole survivor of Speeder 2 rally while only the Catachan Veterans fail to rally or clear any Blast markers for the Catachans. _________________ "EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?
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Chroma	Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 12:28 am
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:06 pm Posts: 9684 Location: Montréal, QC, Canada	Turn 3 No teleports. Strategy roll: Catachans (on a tie) The Catachans Devils move to engage Scout Detachment 1, wiping out the Marines and taking the Marine Blitz. With another loud battle cry, the sole survivor of the Ogryn, the Commissar and his big buddies, rushes down the hill to engage the Predators. ?One Marine tank is smashed open, but the Ogryn are pushed back, and retreat up the hill back to lurk in the jungle. The Devastators advance on the Veteran Company, felling 2 Valkyries and breaking the formation. The Thunderbolt Squadron has a hard time hearing their orders over all their cheering from the killing of a Titan, but the Catachan Commander finally gets through and they perform another ground attack on the surviving Titan, but only place a single Blast marker on it. ?(That's two BMs on the Warhound, for all those counting?) The Regimental HQ hesitates on its advance against Speeder Detachment 1 and elects only to fire, placing a single Blast marker. The Predators attempt to double to where they're needed but the shame of losing one of their tanks to a small band of big abhumans causes them to fire the Vindicator into the jungle at the nearby Ogryn, to no effect. The Mortar Platoon sustains fire on the surviving Warhound? only 2 Mortar Teams are in range, but it's enough to break the Titan. (Boy, was my opponent pissed about that! ?*laugh*) Scout Detachment 2 tries to clear the Catachans off of their Objective 2 by firing on the Mortar Platoon, but has no effect. The Sentinel Squadron marshals, spreading out to protect the Catachan Blitz. Speeder Detachment 1 marshals, moving to contest Marine Objective 1, with the Regimental HQ had been trying to secure. End of turn: Catachans 1 (Blitz) vs Marines 1 (BTS) Yet again all Marine units except the sole survivor of Speeder 2 rally while only the Mortar Platoon fails to rally or clear any Blast markers for the Catachans [Forgot to snap a picture of the End of Turn!] _________________ "EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?
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Chroma	Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 12:38 am
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:06 pm Posts: 9684 Location: Montréal, QC, Canada	Turn 4 No teleports. Strategy roll: Marines The sole Warhound Titan doubles across the Catachan rear to blast the Sentinels off of the Catachan Blitz? both of the frail walkers are blown apart. Scout Detachment 2 moves up to engage the Mortar Platoon? no casualties are inflicted in the initial assault, but the tenaciousness of the Scouts send the Mortar Teams packing, leaving 1 Team behind. (Marines won by "1", the "not outnumbered" rule helped them there!) Once more, the Commissar leads his brave Ogryn forward to engage the Predators, getting into base contact with the Vindicator. ?In a shocking display of aggression, all three remaining Marine tanks are rent into scrap metal, causing the nearby Devastators to suffer a Blast marker. ?One more cheer from the Catachans! The Regimental HQ can't get any traction forward, even with the Supreme Commander and Commissar urging them on, so the just fire on the nearby Speeder 1 Detachment, taking out 2 Speeders and breaking the Marine formation and securing Marine Objective 1. The Devastators try to get to where they need to be, but the taunting of the nearby Ogryn frustrates them enough that they just turn and fire, laying waste to the Commissar and his abhuman warriors? The Thunderbolt Squadron strikes again at the Warhound, but only manages to drop a single Void shield. The Veterans double forward, hurling demolition charges, to break the Warhound and send it fleeing. Taking a well earned rest, the Catachan Devils firmly secure the Marine Blitz? End of turn: Catachans 2 (Blitz, T-n-H) vs Marines 1 (BTS) _________________ "EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?
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Honda

Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 3:53 am

Brood Brother Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:44 pm Posts: 1891 Location: Katy, Republic of Texas

Chroma, Excellent report, I really enjoyed it. However, the following really puzzled me: Scout Detachment 1 Supreme Commander Scout Detachment 2 Chaplain Why were high value leaders attached to somewhat susceptible Scouts, when at least the SC should have been put on a tactical? Just curious what the thinking was behind that decision. Thanx! _________________ Honda "Remember Taros? We do" - 23rd Elysian Drop Regiment

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The_Real_Chris	Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 5:43 am
Brood Brother Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 4:45 pm Posts: 8139 Location: London	ATSKNF wise I really like the idea that Leader counts double - it reinforces taking commanders and get the formations ready to attack again nicely. _________________ If using E-Bay use this link to support Tac Com! 'Abolish red trousers?! Never! Red trousers are France!' – Eugene Etienne, War Minister, 1913 "Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography." General Plumer, 191x
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Chroma	Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 5:50 am
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:06 pm Posts: 9684 Location: Montréal, QC, Canada	Quote (Honda @ 15 April 2006 (03:53)) Why were high value leaders attached to somewhat susceptible Scouts, when at least the SC should have been put on a tactical? Just curious what the thinking was behind that decision. Well, my opponent had designed his army as a "recon" battle group, so I suppose that's why he put the Supreme in the Scouts.  I would've put him in the Devs in this army, though the Librarian's MWFF3+ is pretty sweet.  Heck, with Marines it's always an option to *not* take a Supreme Commander, with 1+ Initiative.  I wonder what that extra 100 points could've been spent on... With the "only vastly outnumbered" rule in play, the Scouts could be a lot more aggressive against larger formations, so the Chaplain helps with that. It *is* kind of funny seeing a Marine army with no Tacticals. If my opponent had activated the remaining Warhound earlier in Turn 3, I think he could've quite easily won the game.  His response afterward was "I didn't think you had anything that could really hurt it... never considered you just try to *break* it!" _________________ "EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?
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Chroma	Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 5:53 am
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:06 pm Posts: 9684 Location: Montréal, QC, Canada	Quote (The_Real_Chris @ 15 April 2006 (05:43)) ATSKNF wise I really like the idea that Leader counts double - it reinforces taking commanders and get the formations ready to attack again nicely. Well, with Marines getting the "normal" "blast markers equal to half the number of units" when a formation rallies, the 1BM from leader helps nicely.  If you *add* that Marine leaders take away *two* BMs, then Marines will almost always clear all their Blast markers... which *might* not be a bad thing... We found the changes we made to TSKNF to really help the Marines, even if it was only subtly... they definitely need some help. _________________ "EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?
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Honda

Post subject: [BatRep] Catachans vs Space Marines - 2500 points Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 11:30 am

Brood Brother Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:44 pm Posts: 1891 Location: Katy, Republic of Texas

Well, my opponent had designed his army as a "recon" battle group, so I suppose that's why he put the Supreme in the Scouts. ?I would've put him in the Devs in this army, though the Librarian's MWFF3+ is pretty sweet. ?Heck, with Marines it's always an option to *not* take a Supreme Commander, with 1+ Initiative. ?I wonder what that extra 100 points could've been spent on... Ok, fair enough on the SC. Not what I would have done, but that sounds reasonable...and yes, Librarians are very nice. Regarding whether SM's should take a SC, their initiative tends to lead one to believe that they don't need a SC, but my own personal observation is that they need it more than other armies. Firstly, because of all the 1's I've seen Space Marine players roll. But more importantly, the SM often times need to take two actions together. One to set up an attack and the other to deliver the hammer blow. If the hammer blow doesn't arrive, then the first move can get left hanging out in the wind and will more than likely get severely damaged in a counter-attack. One of the other things I've noticed about the SM is that they need to be able to strike hard while at the same time preserving their forces because it isn't often that they outnumber their opponents. With the "only vastly outnumbered" rule in play, the Scouts could be a lot more aggressive against larger formations, so the Chaplain helps with that.

I saw that you mentioned this early in your report and I am unfamiliar with it. Is this a new experimental rule that is being proposed? Where is it referenced?


It *is* kind of funny seeing a Marine army with no Tacticals.


Well, the current thinking around here (i.e. Houston) is that Terminators are the only way to go, but I think Tacticals have a strong role to play in any SM force.


If my opponent had activated the remaining Warhound earlier in Turn 3, I think he could've quite easily won the game. ?His response afterward was "I didn't think you had anything that could really hurt it... never considered you just try to *break* it!"


Ah, yes, I thought that was very clever of you. There is more than one way to skin a, er, "hound".