Login |  Register |  FAQ
   
Post new topic Reply to topic  Page 6 of 15
  [ 220 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 ... 15  Next

Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
BlackLegion
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 3:15 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2005 12:13 am
Posts: 8711
Location: Leipzig, Germany, Europe, Sol III, Orion Arm, Milky Way, Local Group, Virgo Supercluster, Universe
Anidea would be to make turretless tanks move slower, because they have to align the whole vehicle to target the enemy?

_________________
We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 5:55 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 4:45 pm
Posts: 8139
Location: London
That's where tactical/top speeds come in, as well as rate of fire.

If you need a high rate of fire you will spend a lot of time stationary firing, but if you are shoot and scoot or something like a bunker buster one shot is enough.

I guess that would effect its overall firepower, something Epic doesn't do as well as other systems, as compared to a turreted vehicle you would be getting less shots off when attacking. Defensively of course it is a different matter, and look at those Swiss tanks for that idea taken as far as we can. Target type is also important, against a slow mover a turret doesn't matter much.

Ultimately they have always been a stop gap between a technological advance and getting a proper set up for it. We are increasing seeing modular designs come up now so I wouldn't be surprised if an arms race kicked off turretless main guns make a comeback.

Entirely off topic but the new vtol yank fighter is very interesting - not for what it does but for how its built. Its the first plane not to have everything hardwired, instead it runs through software. To illustrate what I mean if a hard drive on a 5-15 breaks you need to go and find the same 356 megabyte model. Anything else could cause unforeseen problems. On this beast just plug in the latest x gigabyte drive, run it through your simulator, make the changes to the code, upload it and off you fly. It makes upgrades to avionics, weapons, everything a doddle and could recapture the longevity of planes like the F-4.

_________________
If using E-Bay use this link to support Tac Com!
'Abolish red trousers?! Never! Red trousers are France!' – Eugene Etienne, War Minister, 1913
"Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography."
General Plumer, 191x
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Legion 4
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 6:18 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 5:13 pm
Posts: 36947
Location: Ohio - USA
Yes, the S-tank is primarily Defensive, based on terrain and the home country's doctrine. ?However, the assault gun concept, initially was to mount a larger cannon then could be on an exsisting chassis with turret. And inturn could be quickly made and possibly up armor the front hull. ?Now in A/H's Panzer Leader, AFVs without turrets could only move at ? mov't rate and fire. ?So that could work in Epic. IMO any assault gun should move slower, have a higher Sav/AR, and if you really want to add detail, can only move & fire at Advanced rate or on Fire Orders ...




_________________
Legion 4 "Cry Havoc, and let slip the Dogs of War !" ... "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Fredster4050
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:36 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2007 4:20 am
Posts: 47
Location: Exeter UK
Summary of a Batrep, 4000 points a side.
Minervan vs Lost & Damned

Unfortunately I didn't take any pictures but I will for next time!

Minervans

SHTC(A) - 2xShdwswrd 1 XBB 500
SHTC(B) - 2XStrmswd 1x Strmbld 500
LR (1 Vanq) + 3 Thunderers 730
10 LR 600
6 Thunderers 240
2 X Bombards 500
Vultures 300
Flak 150
DStrike 200
Warhound 250

Vs a mixed Inf/Armoured L&D army

Basically a complete slaughter to the Minervans

SHTC A killed first Lord of Battle in turn 1, Dstrikes killed the other in Turn 2.
Massed LR fire took apart Arm.Infantry units
Vultures killed Silver Towers
Bombards dealt with other Arm.Infantry unit
SHTC B finished off any Inf survivors


Observations
Overlapping LR companies are devastating
Tank Platoons are very useful as mobile reserve
Slow armies will be pulverised on the way in

Questions

Why are LR only 60 points when 65 in main IG list, seems underpointed?
Having access to all the good stuff, Dstrikes, Vultures etc without any premium plus cheap LR seems just too powerful?
SHTC may need points revision especially for non-standard models?

I hope to publish a more comprehensive Batrep soon
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Soren
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:37 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 9:42 am
Posts: 694
Location: Austria
Not underpointed, but try to get two Companies worth of them (with some upgrade) in a 3k game (normal size). else they have several weaknesses included more than worth the 5 point discount. You can play the things you did basically with a standard Steel legion List (exept the platoon). Everything you bought is available to a SLL. Seems to me more like a problem of the LatD player to play against armor heavy armies. Try this against Eldar :D

To SHTC. cannot say much, as I didn?t use anything other than a Shadowsword. They are quite easy to kill with TK or even MW.

And yes Thunderer with their MW are too cheap. The demolisher change played some tricks you were using extremely. LR are quite OK.




_________________
Attrition is the proof of absence of Strategy
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:46 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20886
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire
Aye, the Demolisher change has undoubtedly broken the list, and I havn't yet made up my mind how to fix it.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Soren
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:47 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 9:42 am
Posts: 694
Location: Austria
simply put thunderer and demolisher to rare. Thunderer should be rare anyway, as they are scrapped  destroyers. And destroyers are not numerous.

Leaves LR, Conqueror and Exterminator as standard tanks which is quite accurate I think




_________________
Attrition is the proof of absence of Strategy
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:52 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20886
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire
I think that's the best way to go about it.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Moscovian
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 6:05 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 6:32 pm
Posts: 6414
Location: Allentown, Pennsylvania USA
I agree with Soren.  The discount of 5 points per tank saved you 100 points for the list which I don't think was the swaying factor. :)  I didn't see anything about your list that was particularly 'Minervan-ish', although that is bound to happen from time to time.  Perhaps you can try to switch armies and see how well you do against the Minervans.  Just a suggestion.

_________________
author of Syncing Forward and other stories...

It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Soren
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 6:40 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 9:42 am
Posts: 694
Location: Austria
mhm, maybe we could do another upgrade for tank companies called Assault guns, let?s say 50pts per Basilisk, Medusa or something like this. But on the other side. The Tank companies are expensive, so nobody would buy this......it?s more important to field at least some hydras.....




_________________
Attrition is the proof of absence of Strategy
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Fredster4050
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 10:30 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2007 4:20 am
Posts: 47
Location: Exeter UK
I didn't see anything about your list that was particularly 'Minervan-ish'


Yes as Soren said you could get alot of this from SLL, but just how varied from SLL will you be able to get with a list made up from IG tanks!!

I'm sure I could have used more Tank platoons and maybe some of the assault guns, but frankly why would I against L&D?

I appreciate that this is playtesting, however I prefer to be able to design my forces to face the opponent rather than test list possibilities, as force flexibility is inevitably part of design. This mainly comes about as I am a club player not a tournament player therefore know my opponent and his force in advance, and in all seriousness most of these lists are for club design.

Against Eldar I may go for more platoons to allow more activations so I will withold judgement on the lower points until I play some more

Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Soren
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 10:52 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 9:42 am
Posts: 694
Location: Austria
No problem with your list design. Sometimes my own Minervan list is not different from a bloody plain Steel Legion list. But this reports are not posted on this board, as they add nothing to E&C?s design process :) And in most other cases I field 4 Minervish units, which is 50% of the list. Maybe you will get a good guide if you try to reach this with your armies. You will see, you can trim it toward the enemy anyway, even when using infantry, tank platoons or special tanks in you Russ?companies without getting cheesy. (my guys here also like to play, not to playtest and getting butchered by freaky compositions just to find our holes in a list)




_________________
Attrition is the proof of absence of Strategy
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Inquisitor_Alanius
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:44 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 323
Location: Gouda, Neferlundz

(The_Real_Chris @ Nov. 02 2007,18:18)
QUOTE
Course all this makes no reference to tactical speed. IG tanks are like WWII ones that have to be stationary to fire accurately so that would be a big factor. Stuff like the destroyer would take a lot longer over a shot, but go a lot faster otherwise and so on. The conqueror higher speed tactically according to its description is all about an easier to use main gun.

Guys,

Sorry to be a stick in the mud, but in the Gaunts Ghosts Novels (specifically first descibed in Honour Guard), guard tanks can all fire and move with no loss of accuracy, thanks to the Auspex Control System, only the Infardi AT70's cannot.

And as you go further into the novels, no Imperial Tanks loses either RoF or Accuracy from moving and firing.

Course this presumes that you use the Novels as canon (and to be frank what Abnett is producing is 100% better than the core '40K' stuff).

My Two pence.

Alan.

_________________
"Thou shalt not suffer the Xenos to live!"
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 12:52 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20886
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire
You're talking about one specific regiment in one book, and Dan Abnett is notoriously elastic with the background. A bunch of Tanith killing Khorne Berzerkers in close combat makes a good read, but it's not particularly true to the background.

The background for 40k makes it quite clear that most Leman Russ types cannot fire on the move without a significant loss of accuracy, that's why the Leman Russ Conqueror is so 'special', because it can fire on the move reliably.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Inquisitor_Alanius
 Post subject: Minervan Tank Regiment 1.6
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 1:24 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 323
Location: Gouda, Neferlundz
E&C, compared to what GW have did to the games setting & background, Abnetts few book to book alterations are purest gospel!

:p

But overall, with the STC background, any MBT which can't fire decently on the move is not worth the name.

not suggesting even 90% accuracy here, I'd accept Canadian Cup 75% scores!

_________________
"Thou shalt not suffer the Xenos to live!"
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
  Print view Previous topic | Next topic 
Post new topic Reply to topic  Page 6 of 15
  [ 220 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 ... 15  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 18 guests

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


Powered by phpBB ® Forum Software © phpBB Group
CoDFaction Style by Daniel St. Jules of Gamexe.net