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Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2005 9:08 pm
Posts: 356
Location: Beavercreek, Ohio, USA
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(Legion 4 @ May 21 2007,21:44)
QUOTE As a former Grunt Cdr, Combat Arms Maneuver Forces ?cross-attach and fight combined arms. ?Inf units attached to tank units, or tank units attached to Inf units all take orders from the ranking officer. And all call for fire support from the FA. As a Mech Co. Cdr, I usually had a Tank Plt attached to my Co., he took orders from me and my XO. And when my Co. was attached to a Tank Bn, I followed the Bn Cdr and XOs orders. So I think you all are making this a little too difficult. Commanders command, Leaders lead ... ? ? ?I didn't tell the FA gunners how to fire their guns, I told them where to put their fire, thru the FO attached to my Plt. or Co. ?I didn't tell the Tank Plt Ldr attached to my Co., how to operate their AFVs, I told him how his Plt. is intergrated into the mission ... So I'm not sure if you guys get how combined arms command works. If you want to add a little "realism" to the command rules, that's kind of the way it works ... but as always DWWFY ! 
(I'd love to see some of the non-Americans try to figure that paragraph out...)  
BUT... What you talked about, where if you have mixed mechanized companies running around and whoever is in charge is running the show, regardless of branch, is still alive in the regular IG rules and what I have proposed. You take an infantry company and attach a Leman Russ Squadron. You take a Tank Company and attach a Tactical Platoon. None of that changes.
One of the main ideas behind what I proposed was to eliminate the possibility of an infantry company getting two other companies (as undersized as they may be) to do a combined assault. Company commanders, especially in an organization as rigidly controlled as the IG, don't tell other company commanders to assault with them. That is what the battalion, ...er, I forgot, GW is English, Regimental commander is supposed to do.
Another idea behind what I was trying to do was to bring back the concept of platoons operating independently of each other, yet still operating as a company. (The only way to get a platoon to do anything in the current army list is if you add it to a platoonless company.) This had to work within the boundaries of trying to change how th IG operate without inflicting a large amount of price changing. I wanted to allow artillery companies to still be able to do huge fire missions, allow tank companies to fire en' masse, etc. because if you take that away you have dramatically altered one of the fundamental characteristics of the IG - Company sized attacks. Yet, the attacks should stay to the company and not be a multi-company affair.
Something that is only alluded to in what I proposed, yet would need to be addressed, is that with a Soviet-style military that does not encourage a proffessional NCO establishment, like the IG, the chain of command becomes very important. Opposing players should have the opportunity to disrupt the chain of command by knocking out the company commanders.
Under the current rules, if you destroy the Vanquisher in a Tank Company, what happens? Nothing.
If you knock out the company commander in the Artillery Company, what happens? Not Applicable (N/A), because the commander for the Artillery Company has been abstracted out.
Hey, do I see a reason for those Salamander Command tanks from Forge World? Or maybe I can use those excess Chimeras for something now?
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BlackLegion says: 1. Splitting a company in 3+ formations would give the IG an insanely high amount of activations. The IG is supposed to be large numbers and unwieldly. Your proposal makes them very flexible.
Yes and no. Again. 
To give each company a commander you are going to have to increase the points cost of the company to reflect the added Commander Special ability. We might also want to eliminate some or all of the price breaks that the companies get (compared to getting individual platoons) to account for the extra flexibility. By doing this you are reducing the number of companies that are going to be present due to higher points costs, thereby reducing the number of activations.
To put some of that inflexibility back in we would have to make it so that the IG player would have to activate 3 formations every time the IG player works his troops. I'd also like to make it so that the IG has some flexibility such that the three formations activated do not have to be from the same company.
Look below...
Steel Legion Infantry Company - 250 points
1x Infantry Command formation of 1x Imperial Guard Command unit
2x Infantry Platoon formations of 6x Infantry units each platoon
2x Support formations allowed
3x Company Upgrade formations allowed
1D3 Commissars allowed
Steel Legion Mechanised Infantry Company - 400 points
1x Mechanised Infantry Command formation of 1x Imperial Guard Command unit and 1x Chimera
2x Mechanised Infantry Platoon formations of 6x Infantry units and 3x Chimera each platoon
2x Support formations allowed
3x Company Upgrade formations allowed
1D3 Commissars allowed
Steel Legion Tank Company - 700 points
1x Command Tank formation of 1x Leman Russ or 1x Leman Russ Vanquisher (has Commander Special Ability)
3x Tank Squadron formations of 3x Leman Russ or 3x Leman Russ Demolisher each platoon
2x Support formations allowed
3x Company Upgrade formations allowed
1D3 Commissars allowed
Steel Legion Super Heavy Tank Company - 550 points
1x Command Super Heavy Tank formation of 1x Baneblade or 1x Shadowsword (has Commander Special Ability)
2x Super Heavy Tank Platoon formations of 1x Baneblade or 1x Shadowsword each platoon
2x Support formations allowed
3x Company Upgrade formations allowed
1D3 Commissars allowed
Steel Legion Artillery Company - 700 points (750?)
1 Command formation of 1x Salamander Command vehicle (with Commander Special Ability) or 1x Imperial Guard Command unit and 1x Chimera
3x Steel Legion Artillery battery formations of 3x Basilisk, 3x Bombards, or 3x Manticore
2x Support formations allowed
3x Company Upgrade formations allowed
1D3 Commissars allowed
All support formations as per normal, extra formations added to the company.
All company upgrades listed as platoons, squadrons, or batteries are added as extra formations while the others (Snipers, Ogryns, and Flak) are added onto the appropriate command formation.
BlackLegion says: 2. If you say that each company needs an as part of the comopanys activation one activation roll for each platoon/squadron/battery to counter the high activation number you archive nothing else as to decrease the firepower of the company. Because some platoons could fail to activate, while others can shoot, etc.
Each formation (platoon) would have to roll for activation on its own unless the Company Commander invokes his Commander Special Ability. In that case only one activation roll would need to be made but the number of activations considered to be made is equal to the number of formations involved.
BlackLegion says: Really this is too fiddly.
Well, I don't know how to help you. I would have thought that compared to the Eldar in the Swordwind Book and the Tyranids that this would not be too hard to handle. Sorry...
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I shot a Deathstrike Missile and destroyed an enemy titan in my pajamas last night. ?How it got into my pajamas I still don't know...
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