Cough

Combine that with their armour save, and a single hit will likely take them out of the entire game... and unlike artillery they can't be hiding at the back of the battlefield for the whole game.

Maybe TRC can leverage some use out of them, but not us mere mortals.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

Hydra units can put out a decent amount of firepower on OW to defend against TP, give AA coverage to Artilery. and can march on T3 to take a objective. I think they are a very good formation.. and probably better value than RRs

_________________

My Photobucket

I used to have two formations of Rough Riders as a constant in my Guard army. This year's modifications have resulted in one of them being dropped. (Everbody used to just shoot at them )

I think it's clear that there haven't been any real cases of rough rider spam. Though their epic abilities seem excessive background-wise, there doesn't seem to be a major play issue.

Isn't there an easy way to make them viable that IS more consistent with the background though?

I mean the only reason they have that extra attack IIRC, is Jervis thinking "Hey there needs to be at least one unit in the main rulebook that has First Strike", and at that stage of rules it had to be an EA. Hardly a game background or rules balance reason.

_________________
http://hordesofthings.blogspot.co.nz/

To be honest first strike makes sense, They have hunting lances that hit at the start of combat and explode, and then discard them and go to secondary weapons immediately after and go into normal combat.. if anything deserves first strike they do... they change lances between combats.

_________________

My Photobucket

Yes first strike is fine of course, but not first strike EA. This is the problem in terms of background (with assault marines being the typical comparison).

_________________
http://hordesofthings.blogspot.co.nz/

But as I said.. in the background. They hit once at a range of 7 or so feet from the opponent, then pull swords and fight normally when they close. I think First Strike EA represents this well.. I know in 40k they no longer work like this.. but if I remember correctly, the first combat in a game they got an extra power weapon attack that went before everything else and then fought normally. I know they removed the rule in the more recent editions, but I believe this was mainly for paperwork reasons.

To be honest they should probably be FS MW EA+1 but that would be silly.

_________________

My Photobucket

Just because they had two attacks in 40k doesn't mean they should get two in epic though, it's the relative power that's important. Assault marines get two attacks in 40k, only one in epic.
However, perhaps they were (and should be) proportionally better than assault marines in terms of sheer amount of CC? If so I might be persuaded to change my mind I suppose, even if assault specialist in PA having less CC than guy on horse seems a little strange.

_________________
http://hordesofthings.blogspot.co.nz/

well the PA gives them a decent save, which RR most definitely don't have. However pressure sensitive claymore mines strapped to poles do do a lot more damage when you poke someone with them than a chainswords.

_________________

My Photobucket

I would propose that any jet pack wearing assault marine that actually got hit by a pressure sensitive claymore strapped to a pointy stick .. deserves to get blown up. However, that image doesn't really mesh with most people's idea of Space Marine Assault specialists.

From a game perspective though, I agree that without the extra attack Rough Riders seem lacklustre. In that they don't have one ideal situational use to balance the many disadvantages of low save, mounted infantry.