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Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA

 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 10:12 am 
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Would it break the list to allow up to two support detachments of a wing for each core choice? So, up to two ravenwing or line support for each ravenwing core choice for example? Basically, exactly what warhamster said... Nice looking force by the way...


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2016 5:37 pm 
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*Disclaimer: My opponent and I are super new to Epic (although I do have a lot of experience with other GW games), so apply salt grains as necessary.

Played 3 Minigeddon games with this list over the weekend, all against the Ork War Horde. Games 1 and 2 went to the DA (4-0 T3 and 3-1 T3 respectively), while the Orks eked out a 2-1 on T4 for the third game. Not going to do any sort of batreps, but will go over some thoughts, in no particular order
-- Plasma Tacticals seem to do better than the traditional missile launchers. The shorter range is a trade-off, but worth it. I'll be trying these again.
-- Terminators are risky in Minigeddon. Lots of eggs in a basket, and without the ability to retain or support with T-hawks or drop pods the whole 'shock-and-aw' teleport thing loses some oomf. Poor valiant souls were lost in both games. That said, the Knights seemed to be about the right place for a free upgrade; I'm not sure I'd take them every game due to the loss of flexibility.
-- The Speeders were a very solid unit. Darkshroud feels like almost an auto-include, as much for the 6th unit as for the cover. The Vengeance were also a nice inclusion. Typhoons as a 2-of don't feel like they fit with the other DA stuff (which I played with 30cm Assault Cannons, as per my earlier post). Maybe inclined to either remove them as an option or allow the up-to-5 50 point upgrade that Codex Marines have.
-- Not sure how I feel about the Black Knights upgrade. Feels a little expensive for what it gives. With 2 Knights using the same mode the odds of the upgrade being relevant in a given combat work out to ~0.27 against Ork Boyz (close to best case scenario) or ~0.17 against Marines (with FS saving you that many Bikes, or the improved FF resulting in that many extra enemy casualties). I might try a Chaplain Knight, as a FS EA Macro-weapon might make them more relevant (in CC saves an extra 0.12 Bike from death against either earlier example, pushing them up to 0.39 and 0.29 respectively, so averaged to save 1 Bike about once every 3 combats); that's getting pretty expensive though.
-- I didn't use the Hunt for the Fallen objective, so no thoughts there.
-- Composition restrictions don't really come into play at this level, so no comments there either.

And the lists for reference

DA List for game 1
275 - [BTS] Land Speeders: 3x Land Speeder Tornado, 2x Land Speeder Vengeance, 1x Darkshroud
225 - Ravenwing: 2 Bikes, 2 Black Knights, 1 Attack bike
275 - Tactical: 6 Tactical Plasma, 3 Rhinos
225 - Scout: 4 Scouts, 3 Las Razorbacks, 1 Rhino

DA List for games 2-3
350 - [BTS] Deathwing: 2 Terminators, 2 Deathwing Knights
225 - Ravenwing: 2 Bikes, 2 Black Knights, 1 Attack bike
275 - Land Speeders: 3x Land Speeder Tornado, 2x Land Speeder Vengeance, 1x Darkshroud
150 - Scout: 4 Scouts, 2 Rhinos

Ork list for all 3 games
315 - [BTS] Warband: 2 Nobz, 6 Boyz, 2 Grots, Battlefortress
285 - Stompamob: 3 Stompas (1 3x Big Gun, 2 2x Big Gun 1x Kombat 'Ammer ), 1 Dread, 1 Kan
200 - Blitz Brigade: 4 Gunwagons, Oddboy w/ Supa-Zzap-Gun
200 - Kult of Speed: 8 Warbikes


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2017 8:29 pm 
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Any movement or games with this list lately?


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Fri Jan 26, 2018 3:02 pm 
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I think about starting a marine army. Either wolfs and Dark angels. Having just read this thread I think the list actually looks like a lot of fun. I quite like the no allies and restricted army selection theme.

Is this list dead? I just wonder with basically no replies in 1,5 years and with the australians wanting to go their own way with lists. I hope it's not! Thought I'd give some feedback anyways.

  • I don't like the "hunt for the fallen"-rule. Both for the optionality of it but also since it replaces the blitz victory condition. Blitz is something that the opponent normally can take back and cancel between turns. This means the Dark Angels player have access to two victory conditions (with BTS) that the opponent can't do anything about after they've been achieved. This is a considerable boost in the tournament scenario since two conditions are needed to win.

    I think a fairer rule would be for it to replace the BTS victory condition, both for the above reason but also since BTS is about the same thing (destroying a unit/formation and not about taking ground).
  • Under ironwing it says
    For every Ravenwing detachment taken you may take one Ironwing Support and one Line Company detachment
    Ravenwing should be replaced with ironwing.
  • The header in the army list for both the first and the second part reads Dark Angel Line Companies
    I assume this should be, for the first part with the different wings, Dark Angels Core companies/detachments
  • In the approved lists (like IF) the Land Raider crusader can transport two terminator stands. ANd the hurricane bolters give (small arms, EA +1). I think units should preferably be the same between lists.


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Fri Jan 26, 2018 3:22 pm 
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Not sure if Mard's planning on running with this or not any more. It's an EpicAU list already (though one that I was happy to adopt into NetEA if it was a good fit for balance during my tenure as AC). I do know they're all pretty focused on CANCON coming up this weekend.

-Good idea about the BTS. Might be a better fit.
-Yes LR Crusader is Hurricane Bolters EA +1 (though they do have 2x of them) and going off what everything else that's established has been for a while isn't really a good idea.

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:38 pm 
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Borka, the EpicUK list also has no allies and some extra rules for the DA units... ;-)

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:54 am 
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mordoten wrote:
Borka, the EpicUK list also has no allies and some extra rules for the DA units... ;-)

Yeah I had a look at it, but it lacks a bit in flavor compared to this list. There's no vengeance for instance and I look forward to convert those up. Would also like to play the glaive as it's a really cool looking tank. The UK have slow firing on the devestators as well (but a little better stats) which makes them rather useless IMHO.

I now saw that the upgrade list lacks the hunter upgrade. I assume 75 pts as per the codex list?


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:43 am 
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Borka wrote:
mordoten wrote:
Borka, the EpicUK list also has no allies and some extra rules for the DA units... ;-)

Yeah I had a look at it, but it lacks a bit in flavor compared to this list. There's no vengeance for instance and I look forward to convert those up. Would also like to play the glaive as it's a really cool looking tank. The UK have slow firing on the devestators as well (but a little better stats) which makes them rather useless IMHO.

I now saw that the upgrade list lacks the hunter upgrade. I assume 75 pts as per the codex list?


I wouldn't call the EUK devastators useless... in a drop pod they are utterly fantastic, easily able to vape a shielded warhound with a sustain fire, and they make a great blitz guard formation sat on OW with a pair of hunters

I'd say the UK dark angels list is the strongest UK marine list, without wanting to blow my own trumpet I've got a 7-1-3 WLD record with it, which is way better than any other army I've used, and several of the options in this list need to be carefully watched so we don't end up with codex marines++, that said I have every faith in Mard to reign things in when necessary :)

back to the NetEA/EpicAU list here, I'd like to see Mard carry on developing it, it's clearly got lots of appeal for people who want a fluffy Dark Angels list, and Mard has said he wants to push it through NetEA as well, which needs test games, lots of test games hopefully when he gets CanCon out of the way he can show his latest draft off and we can kickstart development

and I seem to recall that in the latest fluff, Dark Angels don't have hunters, either because they don't need them or they lost the STC file or fell out with mechanicum over it or something, so that's probably why they aren't in the list (gotta have some drawbacks right?)

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2018 8:11 am 
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kyussinchains wrote:
I wouldn't call the EUK devastators useless... in a drop pod they are utterly fantastic, easily able to vape a shielded warhound with a sustain fire, and they make a great blitz guard formation sat on OW with a pair of hunters

No you're of course right they're not useless. It was a way to express that I think slow fire makes them less appealing to me.

kyussinchains wrote:
and I seem to recall that in the latest fluff, Dark Angels don't have hunters, either because they don't need them or they lost the STC file or fell out with mechanicum over it or something, so that's probably why they aren't in the list (gotta have some drawbacks right?)

OK, maybe they should be taken away again from the list then? My comment was directed at the fact that the upgrade is available to a several formations in the list, but it's missing from the upgrade list.


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 2:35 am 
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I'm happy to hand this off Kyuss if you want to re-word it and change things for a NetEA.

I'm a bit burnt out on Epic right now and have sold off my heresy DA's, I may rebuild them as a 40k army down the track, but that won't be for a while.

I'll still jump in and out and work on the Aussie version of the Sisters I've put up. As I'd really like to see them play a bit more competitively then the NetEA version. But I just can't give this list the justice it deserves right now.

I'd just ask that whoever takes it on keeps looking at a trying to make something like "Hunt for the Fallen" work. I really like the idea of some armies having a slightly different Objective to achieve then the standard 5 in the GT supplement as it could be used as a gateway to shake the meta up a little and help change up some lists (Like world Bearers).



Just no primaris plz....


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 10:31 am 
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if you're no longer interested Mard, I am happy to take it on and push it for NetEA approval, or find someone who will, I hope you'll poke your head in from time to time to see how things are going :)

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 2:20 pm 
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kyussinchains wrote:
if you're no longer interested Mard, I am happy to take it on and push it for NetEA approval, or find someone who will, I hope you'll poke your head in from time to time to see how things are going :)


I've got a Dark Angels army that I'm not playing too much at the moment, I like the general look of the NetEA variant and Dark Angels happen to be my favourite Chapter since a loooong time back. I'd like to throw my hat in the ring to steer the Dark Angels list towards approval.

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 3:02 pm 
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If this starts getting proper work done on it I'll do my best to shanghai people in testing and batreps


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 4:11 pm 
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Mrdiealot wrote:
kyussinchains wrote:
if you're no longer interested Mard, I am happy to take it on and push it for NetEA approval, or find someone who will, I hope you'll poke your head in from time to time to see how things are going :)


I've got a Dark Angels army that I'm not playing too much at the moment, I like the general look of the NetEA variant and Dark Angels happen to be my favourite Chapter since a loooong time back. I'd like to throw my hat in the ring to steer the Dark Angels list towards approval.


If you want it, it's yours

that being said, straight up I will nail my colours to the mast, the avenger cannon is too potent for an aircraft weapon, I've had endless circular arguments with folks about it, even batrepped it to illustrate my point, I'm taking charge and banning it..... I've got my eye on the nephilim and dark talon....

right now the EUK version with a twin HB, a lascannon and underwing rockets is one of the best aircraft in our meta, it really doesn't take much to make them overpowered, *please* bear this in mind and don't make me have to step in ;)

this has the potential to be a great, thematic and fun list, I do play EUK dark angels a lot so have more than a passing interest in it!

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Angels v1.2 The long slog to NetEA
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 9:47 pm 
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In that case, I'd be happy to take it on. Will be back with my first proposal, in a new thread, soon.

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