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| Hawk Lords Chapter List http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=73&t=27848 |
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| Author: | jimmyzimms [ Wed Jul 16, 2014 10:30 pm ] | ||
| Post subject: | Hawk Lords Chapter List | ||
Ok you all can thank DoomKitten for his her passing comment about the Hawk Lords in the NetEA Dark Angels poll. Reading up on them I decided to try a weird air heavy list self-planetfalling marine list for them. Think Shock-and-Awe alpha strike with a fair amount of Apocalypse Now 
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| Author: | Doomkitten [ Wed Jul 16, 2014 10:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Fanlist] Hawk Lords Chapter List |
For shame assuming I'm a he! But as you provided this list for my beloved Hawk Lords I suppose I'll let you off this time. |
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| Author: | jimmyzimms [ Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Fanlist] Hawk Lords Chapter List |
Forgive me! 
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| Author: | Doomkitten [ Thu Jul 17, 2014 12:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Hawk Lords Chapter List |
Only because of the jumping devastators! |
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| Author: | Angel_of_Caliban [ Sat Jul 19, 2014 5:59 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: [Fanlist] Hawk Lords Chapter List |
Doomkitten wrote: For shame assuming I'm a he! But as you provided this list for my beloved Hawk Lords I suppose I'll let you off this time. That doesn't mean she is a she either however, just that we shouldn't assume. Interesting list. But.... Where's your Spacecraft? 35cm can deploy on the table but its doesn't say what speed arrives turn 1. 34cm and under? Why no Stormravens or others? |
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| Author: | jimmyzimms [ Sat Jul 19, 2014 4:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Hawk Lords Chapter List |
Since they don't use drop pods and you can't hide a spaceship coming (much like the titans) I've pulled them. You do gain self-planetfall T1 to compensate. Storm Ravens are still GK and BA (or successors) only still I thought or did Grandma Wendy go and retcon that too? Did notice the lack of TBrick transporters so I need to add that too. 35cm>= on table deployment 30cm>= enter on T1 from edge everything else roll D6. Entering on T1 w/4+ roll; Otherwise T2 |
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| Author: | jimmyzimms [ Mon Sep 01, 2014 6:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Hawk Lords Chapter List |
OK, 35 downloads now. Anyone have feedback or anything" 
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| Author: | Consul Avenging Angel [ Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Hawk Lords Chapter List |
I do like stats on Storm Eagles, but I reckon they should be bombers not fighter bombers and perhaps 5+ RA as they are lighter transports. |
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| Author: | jimmyzimms [ Sat Sep 06, 2014 4:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Hawk Lords Chapter List |
I've thought about it as well but as I could easily see us adding the fire raptor into this which is based on the same chassis I held back and gave them FB and not bomber otherwise it'd be useless. I'll also add the Fireraptor is already stat'd in the HH supplement to good effect. Thoughts? Looking back on some 40k books the Storm Eagle is all round 11 so yes, 5+ RA would be in order. Actually TRA would have been appropriate since it can land and be shot at normally but as we failed that on the Thunderbrick originally no reason to add it here. So yeah I'll propose the following errata=> Storm Eagle Fighter-Bomber 5+ 6+ 5+ Reinforced Armour, Planetfall, Transport (four Space Marines or two Terminator units. The Multi-melta can shot and be used to confer the macro-weapon ability to the unit's firefight value. A Storm Eagle formation counts as a single War Engine for transport purposes) IF we do Fireraptors this is the current stats for them from the HH supplement Legion Fire Raptor Gunship AC Fighter Bomber Amrour: 5+ -Twin Linked Avenger Bolt Cannon 30cm 2x AP3+/AT4+, FxF -Tempest Rockets 60cm AP5+/AT5+ FxF -Quad Heavy Bolter 15cm 2x AP4+/AA5+, LF -Quad Heavy Bolter 15cm 2x AP4+/AA5+, RF I'd drop the dakka on the quad bolters to keep it from being OTT for standard E:A (The Death of Isstvan being internally balanced for the inter legionary war). Edit: I'd also make the Tempest rockets 2x -Tempest Rockets 60cm AP5+/AT5+ FxF Single Shot |
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| Author: | Consul Avenging Angel [ Sun Sep 07, 2014 5:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Hawk Lords Chapter List |
I'm glad you agree about the reinforced armour, the reason I was suggesting it became a bomber was purely for game mechanics as there are no fighter-bomber transports but the lecicanum refers that the storm eagle is an assault craft making it a airassault unit (prehaps). Anyhow if you are going to include the raptor or storm talon then it would fit better. |
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| Author: | jimmyzimms [ Sun Sep 07, 2014 5:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Hawk Lords Chapter List |
Storm Talons are already in. I want to get some tests as is before adding in the Storm Raptor but my gut feeling is it would be beneficial in many builds/opponents (especially against swarm lists). |
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| Author: | Ginger [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Hawk Lords Chapter List |
jimmyzimms wrote: Looking back on some 40k books the Storm Eagle is all round 11 so yes, 5+ RA would be in order. Actually TRA would have been appropriate since it can land and be shot at normally but as we failed that on the Thunderbrick originally no reason to add it here. So yeah I'll propose the following errata=> So, on the face of this, the Storm Eagle is more a planetfall or assault mechanism and has no firepower?? With similar armour to a Vampire, this could be a 'courageous' choice - but one that may be OK - a sort of 'poor mans' THawk transporter Storm Eagle Fighter-Bomber 5+ 6+ 5+ Reinforced Armour, Planetfall, Transport (four Space Marines or two Terminator units. The Multi-melta can shot and be used to confer the macro-weapon ability to the unit's firefight value. A Storm Eagle formation counts as a single War Engine for transport purposes) What are the costs for the formation and upgrades? jimmyzimms wrote: IF we do Fireraptors this is the current stats for them from the HH supplement While some may want this, the stats are completely OTT - do you really mean to give a single unit 7x shots, one of which is 60cm - I mean Really?? I will put this down to a brain-fart on your part as your comments are usually so much more sane Legion Fire Raptor Gunship AC Fighter Bomber Amrour: 5+ -Twin Linked Avenger Bolt Cannon 30cm 2x AP3+/AT4+, FxF -Tempest Rockets 60cm AP5+/AT5+ FxF -Quad Heavy Bolter 15cm 2x AP4+/AA5+, LF -Quad Heavy Bolter 15cm 2x AP4+/AA5+, RF I'd drop the dakka on the quad bolters to keep it from being OTT for standard E:A (The Death of Isstvan being internally balanced for the inter legionary war). Edit: I'd also make the Tempest rockets 2x -Tempest Rockets 60cm AP5+/AT5+ FxF Single Shot
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| Author: | jimmyzimms [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Hawk Lords Chapter List |
Ginger, calm down mate. As a stated above these are that stats from the Horus Heresy supplement as is which are not appropriate for epic without change. You conveniently cut the quote early to leave off where I specifically mentioned they're OTT as to be expected as HH is designed to be internally balanced.  As you're here I'd like to come up with something appropriate for E:A. I'm thinking Rt/Lt Twin Heavy bolters (which should focus on defensive AA only), two single shot missiles (probably just nab the standard Hellfire one, thoughts?), and the twin linked avenger. Want to give a stab at a first pass? |
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| Author: | Ginger [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 4:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Hawk Lords Chapter List |
Being a complete 'fluffyphobe' I know nothing of the Legion Fire Raptor Gunship or its stats in 40K. That said, you seem to be suggesting the following Avenger cannon (30cm?) Right/left Heavy bolter (15cm?) *and* 2x Hellfire missiles? Still pretty potent and probably OTT, not least because that would still give lots of shots straight ahead while providing some limited form of all-round defensive fire. The L/R weapons could be limited to just AA (or as a wild thought, a single turret with all round fire?) but really we ought to limit *any* Fighter or F/B a/c to 2x shots, possibly with a single shot weapon. How many in a formation as this has a major bearing on the stats? |
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| Author: | jimmyzimms [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 4:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Hawk Lords Chapter List |
The bolters are assuredly defensive AA. I'm down with the single all around AA5+ 15cm heavy bolters. Makes the unit much simpler to handle. I'm not totally in agreement on the OTT for having two offensive weapons, especially when they don't have stats yet to back that up. Also the single for rockets would massively help that unlike say Thunderbolts which put out way more hurt. The avenger is stat'd in an approved list (AMTL) which I don't have in front of me ATM but being twin linked we should be able to +1 (or if too much we can direct it as x2 -1 shots). I'd be inclined in THIS list to structure them as singletons that are tied to escorting the Thunderbricks (1:1 probably...thoughts?). They're more with fluff and tactics to punch a hole in enemy armour and fixed defenses to enable the combat drop and would as such try to structure this list to make that so (ideas most welcome). I'll note that I am not certain they are even needed until I get something more than theory-hammer. I'd really like to see them go up against some Tank Legion, Steel Legion, and AMTL to get a feel for their abilities. The FFx avenger should make them a wee bit more unwieldy and less able to avoid AA. Once you shoot your rockets the thing is going to have much greater trouble trying to not get shot down. I'm also inclined to make the rockets 45cm simply for balance and the Hawk Lord propensity for "fire when you can see the whites of their eyes" bit. Edit: OK just pulled up the AMTL Avenger and I wasn't aware that it was already 2x AP3+ / AT5+, Fixed Forward Despite this being twin linked I'm inclined to just leave it as the Avenger and call it good for now. Yes|No|icanhazcheezburger? |
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