Well it was a thought at least. I understand the counters, and I do understand EA is NOT meant to represent all things. Was working under the thought process of:

a) how to you provide for a unit that is specially set to deposit dismounts into prepared defense. I am not convinced up'ing the CC value really does that.

b) how to work it into the exisiting rules system. And after looking it over and not finding anything that seemed to work well, tried to develop something keeping as close as possible to what's already available. And it's not like we don't see new special rules appear each time a new supplement, offical or fan, comes out. Or that this would be the only one with a Trait unique to itself (example being say the LR Prometheus).

Anyhow, just a thought and wanted to see how it was received.

Win the Mind, Win the Day
Airborne All The Way

Personally, I'd like to keep the LRC relatively cheap and pretty much all the LRs in the 75-85 point range except for the Helios.

I don't know if we have a final version of the LRs yet but we at least need versions that can be left unchanged for 1 year. I think we're surely close enough to consensus for that. Let's set some stats and give it a rest.

Fine, as long as those stats don't include half a multimelta.

Ditto.

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Concur.

Should we start a poll for the Crusader or will we finally have finished stats we can agree upon?

And there is still the unsolved Redeemer problem. Should he have 2 x 15cm AP3+ Ignore Cover or 1 x 30cm AP3+ Ignore Cover? And what abotu the FF stat? 3+?,4+? with or without Ignore Cover (no FF Extra Attacks).

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I'd like to see a conclusion to this also, Hena. Cheers

My vote's for a MM upgrade option, much like the Land Speeder deal as it not only gives both sides of the argument a "win" but it also helps fill the dreaded points left over gap that can occur.

I just don't see the flamestorm cannons being 30cm. They're basically just slightly more powerful heavy flamers, and should be treated as such, no?

I'm about to start heavy testing on the Land Raider Redeemer having just scratchbuilt some, but I would suggest that 2x 15cm for the flamestorm cannons makes the most sense.

In 40k, they have a "range" of Zero Inches (Just a template placed next to the gun), so 30cm seems completely unjustifed as it's meant to be a very short range weapon.

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So it sounds more like small arms at most then....

Nah, there's precendent for giving it a 15cm attack, in the Heavy Flamer, which has the exact same range/rules in 40k (Just at a lower strength).

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The 30cm range was suggested because of the Apacalypse Datasheed for a LAnd Raider Redeemer formation. As long as this formation has at least 2 Flamestorm, Canons it can combine these to have a single shot with the same range and placements rules of the Hellhounds Inferno Cannon*
That was the justificaton for trying out a single 30cm shot per Land Raider Redeemer. A 30cm shot for each Flamestorm Cannon was out of the question from the beginning.

Also the design feature of the Salamanders list assumed that if a unit is armed with at least two flamer type weapons (= at least two Ignore Cover ranged shots) it gets Ignore Cover on its basic FF attack. Units affected by this are the Salamanders Terminators, the Predator Incinerator and the Land Raider Redeemer.


*The only difference between the Inferno Cannon and Flamestorm Cannon is the range.

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Hena: The Redeemer is a short-range assault tank. No matter what you do, that will benefit from being close to the enemy. Air drops will therefore always provide a serious force multiplier. I think ideal unit stats that make ground deployment competitive with air drops are impossible. A 30cm flamer attack might help a little but it does not provide a serious fire-support alternative and the primary problem remains.

In the end, that ground-air balance will have to be done by individual army lists.

[quote="nealhunt"
In the end, that ground-air balance will have to be done by individual army lists.[/quote]

And that's why Thunderhawks and Landing Crafts in the Salamanders list cost more.

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