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Thunderhawk Transporters
Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 10:01 am 
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I'll check tonight, but is everyone sure whirlwinds can be Transported? Just wondering how they would fit...


From IA:3:

"(transportable) Rhino variants include: Predator, Razorback, Whirlwind, Vindicator, Damocles.

Land Raider variants include: Crusader, Prometheus, Helios."

Heliosi (that's never a word...) are certainly cool enough... clearly they can be transported by Transporters, but if they're not in the list it really doesn't make all that much difference...

Not yet they're not.  :;):


125 - 150 to start and see what playtesting results produce.

I agree, given the Transporter's limited utility, that 150 is the maximum it should cost, with 125 potentially being a better-suited cost.




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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 10:11 am 
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New page update:




Thunderhawk transporter

Type    Speed  Armour CC  FF
Bomber   na        4+    6+  5+

Weapon                         Range    Firepower   Notes
2 twinlinked heavy bolter  15cm    AP4+/AA5+  Left Arc
2 twinlinked heavy bolter  15cm    AP4+/AA5+  Right Arc

Notes
DC2 (critical=dead), Planetfall, Reinforced armour. Transport: 2 from the following list: rhino, razorback, predator, vindicator, whirlwind, hunter; OR 1 from the following list: Land Raider or Land Raider Crusader; PLUS  any infantry transported in the vehicles

Thunderhawk Transporters sometimes operate in squadrons. If more than one Thunderhawk Transporter is present in a squadron, transported units from a single formation may be spread between Thunderhawk Transporters (this is an exception to the rules in section 3.1.3).

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 11:24 am 
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Although I disagree with some of the wording (insane indeed!), I agree with a lot of Hena's analysis...


Perhaps 150 for one or 275 for two would be best, as that puts the price of two exactly half way between the Gunship and the Landing Craft.

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CAL001
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 2:27 pm 
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Now that is a good idea!

Perhaps 150 for one or 275 for two would be best, as that puts the price of two exactly half way between the Gunship and the Landing Craft


Vote on that sucker and see what we get.

Cheers
CAL

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CAL001
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 2:34 pm 
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One other thing, I think you need to change the stat for the Heavy Bolters, all the HBs in the marine list are 30cm in range and I dont see why the THT should suffer from having small arms range.

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CAL
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ragnarok
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 2:39 pm 
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AA heavy bolters seem to lose half their range on the thinderhawk and landing craft.

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CAL001
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 2:51 pm 
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Tis a gross discrepancy between the land and air systems. They are both the same weapon, TH is a classic example of a bad stat. It has two sets of Twin Linked HB, mounted on the Hull 30cm AP4+, on the wing 15cm Ap4+. Why? No reason I say. If we are gong to give the THt an attack it should be 30cm. Other wise its weapon systems are only going to be affective during air assaults, not during landing operations.

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CAL
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ragnarok
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 2:56 pm 
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I agree that it makes no sense.  would of made more sense if they had a 30cm AP range and a 15cm AA range.

Or what Lord =][= and myself did, and have landed and airborne stats for the weapons.

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Legion 4
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 3:13 pm 
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It's the same weapon ... should have the same range ...

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Lord Inquisitor
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Fri Sep 29, 2006 9:21 pm 
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I've wondered about the weapon ranges myself, and I think the reduced range is to compensate for altitude differences between aircraft and aircraft and ground targets. Essentially, being airborne reduces the effective range, not the ideal range.

Plus I suspect there's a heavy dose of balance issues there.

It is an unfortunate issue that when landed the range isn't improved, but it's an abstraction I can live with (as is the strange ability of landed T-hawk heavy bolters to fire flack at flyers...)

I think 150 each is a perfectly acceptable playtest points value - it's my minimum and E&C's maximum - a good compromise!

Good catch on the Hunters there, too.

Lord =I=
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Legion 4
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2006 6:47 am 
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I'm not sure about the range differences ... but it may work for balance ?

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CAL001
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2006 8:55 am 
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Balance would say that we give one set 30cm and one 15cm the same as a TH.

CAL
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Lord Inquisitor
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 2:24 am 
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(CAL001 @ Sep. 30 2006,03:55)
QUOTE
Balance would say that we give one set 30cm and one 15cm the same as a TH.

Disagree - remember that the main purpose of these are as deterrent against aircraft - and when attacking the regular t-hawk is easy to avoid the front arc. Since the Transporter has all four on the side arcs, it is much better protected from aircraft (i.e. when attacking from the side)

Besides, we should keep the heavy bolters defensive rather than offensive - it is the Transporter, not the Gunship.
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CAL001
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 5:07 am 
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I understand what you are saying lord I, however we have the same weapon accross three aircraft and not one has the same stats. Its crap, one weapon, one set of stats. It deserves its own thred so i will start it.

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CAL

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