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Thunderhawk Transporters
Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 1:28 am 
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On the other hand, Terminator formations would not generally use Thunderhawk Transporters... they'd probably use a Landing Craft (Great name, that!).

T-Hawk Transporters are a specialised vehicle for medium sized formation deployments, more than a T-Hawk, less than a Landing Craft (Can we call it a Thunderhawk Landing Craft yet?). :)

I suppose the 'transport' rule could be rationalized as the T-Hawk Transporter using cargo crates instead of carrying vehicles, sorta like Titan Assault Pods.

re: cost, I'm concerned that you'd be paying 300 points, 100 points more than a standard Thunderhawk, and be getting a somewhat equivilent package (No battlecannon, slightly more resistance to enemy fire). How does 125pts sound?

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Legion 4
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 6:00 am 
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Good stuff Boyz !  I think E&C has it correct, based on the fluff ... I wouldn't have a problem with the troops being loaded in the AFV during transport (but I wouldn't like to do it for real !!!).  And we still Teleport our Terminators as in previous Epic iterations ... :D

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Honda
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 1:45 pm 
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re: cost, I'm concerned that you'd be paying 300 points, 100 points more than a standard Thunderhawk, and be getting a somewhat equivilent package (No battlecannon, slightly more resistance to enemy fire). How does 125pts sound?


I don't have my IA3 handy, but I think that there was also a mention of the TT carrying the equivalent of long range missiles (hunter killer?) for some assaults. I will validate that tonight, but that might help justify the 150 pt cost as it does seem a bit high at the moment.

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Bombot
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 2:17 pm 
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(Evil and Chaos @ Sep. 26 2006,22:05)
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According to Imperial Armour 3, Thunderhawk Transporters do not carry any infantry unless they're loaded inside transported Vehicles.

So uh, that'd nessesitate a change to the rules above, and possibly a points reduction too. I suggest:





Thunderhawk transporter - 100 points.

Type ? ?Speed ?Armour CC ?FF
Bomber ? na ? ? ? ?4+ ? ?6+ ?5+

Weapon ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Range ? ?Firepower ? Notes
2 twinlinked heavy bolter ?15cm ? ?AP4+/AA5+ ?Left Arc
2 twinlinked heavy bolter ?15cm ? ?AP4+/AA5+ ?Right Arc

Notes
DC2 (critical=dead), planetfall, reinforced armour. transport (may transport 2 rhino variants or a single landraider variant, transported vehicles may contain infantry units).

Ok, if that's what IA3 says then who am I to argue?

No need to change the points value though.  It's one single useful use remains to be the ability to transport a Devastor or Scout squad plus their Rhinos.  I think 100 points for a so-so bomber that could put a Scout detachment down and claim an objective at any point is probably too cheap.

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 2:42 pm 
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Now that is interesting; Thunderhawk Transporters can carry up to 6 Hellstrike missiles.

Giving them a battery of one-shot missiles returns them to a valid purchase at 150pts I reckon.


No need to change the points value though.  It's one single useful use remains to be the ability to transport a Devastor or Scout squad plus their Rhinos.


If you allow formation sizes of 1-2 Transporters then they can also transport Tactical detachments (3 rhinos, plus a hunter or a razorback), as well as 4-unit detachments in Land Raiders. They could also transport Predator, Whirlwind & Vindicator detachments.

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 2:53 pm 
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New suggested stats:



One or Two Thunderhawk Transporters - 150 points each.


Type    Speed  Armour CC  FF
Bomber   na        4+    6+  5+

Weapon                              Range    Firepower   Notes
2x twinlinked heavy bolter  15cm     AP4+/AA5+  Left Arc
2x twinlinked heavy bolter  15cm     AP4+/AA5+  Right Arc
2x Hellstrike Missiles          120cm    AT2+            One Shot

Notes
DC2 (critical=dead), planetfall, reinforced armour. transport (may transport 2 rhino hull variants or a single landraider hull variant). In addition it may carry up to 4 Devestator, Scout or Tactical units.




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ragnarok
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 2:58 pm 
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I wouldn't give them the hellstrike missiles.  It makes them too much of a decent attack craft

Also many vehicles don't get any of their optional extras (look at the possible payloads of the thunderhawk and what is actually uses)

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Bombot
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:00 pm 
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Any reason the hellstrikes are AT4+?  They're AT2+ on the Vulture.

Oh, and what Hena said.

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:04 pm 
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Fair enough, might have gone over the top there... reduced the number of Hellstrikes to 2.




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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:05 pm 
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(Bombot @ Sep. 27 2006,15:00)
QUOTE
Any reason the hellstrikes are AT4+?  They're AT2+ on the Vulture.

Oh, and what Hena said.

I was using the IA:3 rules, where they're AT4+ but more plentiful.

Modified 'em to AT2+

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Legion 4
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:08 pm 
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So she can carry 4 stands & 1 L/Rdr or 2 Rhino type AFVs ? ?Does that support the Fluff or are we working on being logical/practical ?




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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:10 pm 
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(Legion 4 @ Sep. 27 2006,15:08)
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So she can carry 4 stands & 1 L/Rdr or 2 Rhino type AFVs ?  Do that support the Fluff or are we working on being logical ?

That's where you've hit the nail on the head... in the fluff and in the 40k rules the infantry capacity is dependant on the types of vehicles carried; there is no embarkation space for infantry anywhere except in transported vehicles.

Being able to transport two Vindicators & four Devestator stands would be totally against the background, yet valid under the rules above.

I really think it needs a note to this effect ala:


Notes:
DC2 (critical=dead), planetfall, reinforced armour. transport (may transport 2 rhino hull variants or a single landraider hull variant, plus any infantry contained within any transported vehicles).




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Legion 4
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:24 pm 
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Well that works for me ... but like I said I would not want to do it for real ...  In the real world, a Chopper can sling load a vehicle and carry the crew/troops inside the Bird (Did that in the 101 and the USMC does it too. Have seen a CH-53 sling a LAV), I think that is where G/W got the idea.    And I see the T/Hawk or THT = to a Chopper.  Where the Landing Craft or Dropship is more like a Cargo Transport, like a C-130, C-141, C-5A or C-17 ...  And troops and vehicles are inside. (Until sometimes they jump and/or dropped out - did that too).  But to make it work for the game and have some sort of "reality", sling the AFV(s) under the THT and the troops ride inside the THT ...

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thunderhawk Transporters
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 3:32 pm 
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I see them somewhat like beach landing craft that carry APC's... they hit the beach, the APC's drive out with infantry inside... kinda helps for ultra-rapid deployment even if it does look very risky to modern eyes!


"The Thunderhawk transporter is the logistical support variant of the standard gunship.....The transporter does not carry troops unless they are pre-loaded into the vehicles." - Imperial Armour 3.

Kinda the standard C-130 to the Thunderhawk Gunship's C-130 SPECTRE. Kinda.  :)

I'm not sure there's a direct analogy really, as it's capable of carrying a single MBT (Land Raider) which even a C-130 cannot.

You were in the 101st? Cool! I was in the 101st for a while... in WW2 Online. :D




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