Seriously. Please stop this mate. It serves no purpose other than to aggravate people.


Actually I think people were keen but were waiting for an updated list to be posted up. The fact people started to play test it showed there are people keen on it.


Well if he does we can always review it at that point.

Reply moved to viewtopic.php?f=4&t=28340

Might wanna start a separate thread here folks

I see GW has ignored all that inconvenient fluff about marines and the navy.

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Nephilim_Jetfighter
Sorry, so the full stats are Init 1+, SR 5, Fighter, Sv5+, all the weapons FxF?
Are we using these stats or the ones in the Darkangels list?

Shame about the no 15cm weapons. Bombers only have 15cm defences in the rear, is just straight powercreep to be able to ignore them. Was always a feature of the Eldar fighters, shame to see it become the new baseline.

Must say surprised at all the agony. If the thunderbolt can be armed with 4 autocannon, 2 lascannon and hellstrikes/bombs/hunters and end up with 15cm AP4+/AA5+, 30cm AP5+/AT6+/AA5+, 30cm AT4+ - you can clearly give whatever you think fits and justify it afterwards.

I would if I had the absolute power have them as 30cm AT4+/AA5+ Forward arc, 15cm AP4+/AA5+ Forward arc, 30cm AT5+ Forward arc, Fighter, save 5+, init 1+, 200 points. So tougher (higher save), more manoeuvrable than a thunderbolt (weapon arcs, fighter), similar firepower, higher init, so 225 for 2. Oh since it is ravenwing 6+ save and an invulnerable save.

On the AMB - apparently a VMB is Heavy 15, S6, AP3, range 60 (most of that means nothing to me, heavy is how many shots? AP3 is the save modifier?)), and AMB is Heavy 7, S6, AP4, range 48? (and the missiles S6, AP4, R 36?)

So in the distant future after a million iteration you can give it different stats to a VMB without not adhering to 40k fluff (shouldn't it have heavy bolters if you are following 40k?), having a lower AP means it would be AP4+/AT5+?

Hi TRC - you evidently missed this debate on power creep in the air-game, and my summary of this here

Ah but your missing the fact that the current tbolts stats are not based on the FW model of either scale. It was never intentionally nerfed for balance etc. They were stats given to the old SG model and any suggestion to change the stats of the tbolts or marauders to match with the FW variants have been shouted down over the years.

Anyhow your translation of the fighter is pretty good, though the missiles are supposed to be one of its main AA weapons, not so much AT. In-fact they suck as AT in 40k.

VMB vs AMB. Basically all I'd draw from the 40k stats comparison is that the AMB has about half the fire power of the VMB and a shorter range. The difference in AP has minimal effect on epic stats, at worst a further reduction in AP value due to decreased effectiveness against power armour.. But that's way down in the weeds.

Not sure I follow your comment on fighter vs bomber range, most have some 30cm range but need to close for full effect?

Ginger, ack some of your fears on power creep but they're were plenty of sound options put up for this AC as well.

If any imperial fighter was likely to equal an eldar fighter it is this one... According to the latest fluff produced by crack smoking, money hungry GW that is.. :p

Defensive flak on bombers and thunderhawks (and other aircrafts) tends to be 15cm behind the aircraft. So 30cm attacks means the marauder or similar will not get to fire defensively as it would against a thunderbolt closing for full effect or ork fighter bomber.

Sure, so give its "machine guns" type 15cm and missiles and heavy cannon 30cm?

Ortron,
The question is, where do we stop if we keep adding a bit to each successive aircraft?
I understand that this might be almost the equivalent of the Eldar Nightwing and peerless among Imperial aircraft - - - - until the next GW spasm . . . .

This is why I respectfully suggest that we abandon trying to match up the GW stats and basically work out a kind of pecking order of weapons, aircraft and their formations. In this, I think it would be wise to work out an acceptable system of conversions and then how to fit the Nephilim within this framework (together with any further GW abortions )

In this, 15cm machine guns may well be acceptable, but until we sort out how we want to limit the air-game as a whole (or at least the new units), this might be a little premature.