No I won't be starting a poll, it's settled already. We'll be sticking with the aircraft version, as the majority and army champion supported in the previous thread.

Errr, simple answer is no....

It is what it is and it's set for now. Carry on

Reading Malodrax the Storm talon is described very much as an aircraft - the IF send it back up from the planet to patrol in orbit as it cannot operate close to the ground like their land speeders

_________________
www.epic-uk.co.uk
NetEA NetERC Human Lists Chair
NetEA Chaos + Black Legion Champion

Excellent back up reference! Give that man a beer.

The reference is indeed good.

However it could still be (and is) interpreted both ways. Or are you advocating the Stormraven becomes an aircraft too?

_________________
"War is not about who is right, but about who is left". - B. Russell

Actually pretty much for the same reasons as for the Thunderhawk the Storm Raven IS an aircraft.

_________________
We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/

BlackLegio, MoK is referring to the Storm Raven stats in the BA and GK lists. There it is an AV, as retarded as that is IMO

edit: I get why it's an AV and not a flyer. The retardiness is the way it must be due to transport rules in EA.

_________________
He's a lawyer and a super-villian. That's like having a shark with a bazooka!

-I HAVE NO POINT
-Penal Legion-Fan list
-Help me make Whitescars not suck!

I know jimmyzimms. I'm refering to the fluff of these two, yes, aircrafts

If the sole reason that the Storm Raven is an AV Skimmer and not an aircraft because of the transport rule then i heartly advice you to take a look at Ork Battlefortresses in the Ghazghkull Army List.

I won't repeat my old proposal to allow certain aircrafts to switch to Skimmer modus

_________________
We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/

Now this would be the best solution, but it would require a considerable rewrite of some rules, and a change in many units across different lists.

We will have to wait for 2nd edition.

_________________
"War is not about who is right, but about who is left". - B. Russell

I honestly believe this approach would be the start of a slippery slope just as it has been for 40k, fantasy battle and Space Hulk. If rules need changing or new mechanics introducing that's one thing, creating a culture of never ending reboots is quite another and will, sooner or later, end in tears... As I see it EA represents edition 4 of epic and I'd say that's far enough.

It is however always possible that I'm just being too conservative.

Or.... we can just accept that things are a certain way and move on....

Yup. Can we carve out the Storm Raven talk into another thread? We're derailing the Black Templar discsussion that SHOULD be happening here [guilty as charged]

_________________
He's a lawyer and a super-villian. That's like having a shark with a bazooka!

-I HAVE NO POINT
-Penal Legion-Fan list
-Help me make Whitescars not suck!

Back on topic, I've been pondering something. Black Templars are very much into melee combat, more so than shooting. Given this, would it be more appropriate for the list to have Assault Terminators instead of normal Terminators? In reality the Templars use both and the 4th Edition codex (the last time BT had their own codex) had both options, however it would be better to focus on one for the list and given their preference for melee it seems to me it would better if they had Assault Terminators out of the two. Modelling wise people could model Sword Brethren Terminators with large actual swords too if pople fancy converting. As a whole the change would further reinforce less shooting options than a regular list and I wanted to throw the idea out there and see what the rest of you think.

Assault Terminators are as Terminators but with CC2+, zero shooting or FF and an invulnerable save (from their Storm Shields). On average a formation of 4 would get 0.66 extra MW hits compared to regular Terminators or 0.833 if they have a character with them. On the other hand they can't hurt skimmers at all and after the initial attack have no ability to shoot other units if they enemy move out of their charge range. They're probably worth the same cost as normal Terminators, but this could be adjusted if playtesting shows it to be needed.

Hopefully I'll get a game in using them on Tuesday against Marconz.

So, what about the THT stats?

Why are they different than in the Scions of Iron?

_________________
"War is not about who is right, but about who is left". - B. Russell

Glyn, I have updated the link for the Index Astartes :
viewtopic.php?f=73&t=23690&p=453307#p453307
on the forum to this new version.