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Blood Angels v2.05
The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 2:55 pm 
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Quote: (Evil and Chaos @ 11 Jun. 2009, 14:39 )

I had been mulling over an idea that perhaps the death company units could be split up and added to other formations ala the Siege Engineers?
Obviously the Special Rule would need to change.

But isn't that the only bit of constant fluff from GW for Blood Angels that the death company fights alone?
Given that it is a 4 strong formation you really should make it a straight 4 strong. Unless you think there is a balance reason for having a 3 strong formation for the thunderhawk at 2000 points or 5 strong at 4000.

Another thing you can do to make life harder (if you want) is to add the hunter into your heavy support selection.

Interesting thought.
Its a small power tweak, so something you can do in the future if there is something that is making the list to tough.

Dreadnought wise do you think its an idea to drop the assault dreadnought as the furious takes its place?
Nah, they fill different slots (pure CC/ mixed CC & range/ pure range).
You really think anyone would go for the ac one? If marines are dropping in every little bit counts.

Incidentally on the Fury dred compare this - 2 lots of assault marines plus chaplains in a thawk (650, +2, 5 1/3, MW1 1/3) vs BA assault marines, chaplain, Dred in thawk (600, +1, 4 1/2, MW1 2/3, +a slow AV). Reckon they are a balanced choice considering the latter is 50 points less? Just me wondering how to use such a formation without automatically going for the upgrade for an 8 strong formation. Wonder how 8 plus chaplain plus 4 vindicators (600 points) compares to a mechanised terminator formation (or a faster 700 point +pred formation).

Oh and of course all for the heavy flamers getting FF ignore cover.

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 3:32 pm 
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Quote: (Evil and Chaos @ 11 Jun. 2009, 14:39 )

Dreadnought wise do you think its an idea to drop the assault dreadnought as the furious takes its place?

Nah, they fill different slots (pure CC/ mixed CC & range/ pure range).

Also remember the idea of giving with one hand and taking with the other...

Maybe cut the long ranged dread as what BA vet is going to want to spend eternity at the back?

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vytzka
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 3:52 pm 
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Quote: (The_Real_Chris @ 11 Jun. 2009, 17:32 )

Also remember the idea of giving with one hand and taking with the other...

Maybe cut the long ranged dread as what BA vet is going to want to spend eternity at the back?

Or you could remove both traditional dreadnoughts and add a MM/PF dread in their place - it's pretty common in Blood Angels artwork.
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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 3:52 pm 
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Quote: (vytzka @ 11 Jun. 2009, 15:52 )

Quote: (The_Real_Chris @ 11 Jun. 2009, 17:32 )

Also remember the idea of giving with one hand and taking with the other...

Maybe cut the long ranged dread as what BA vet is going to want to spend eternity at the back?

Or you could remove both traditional dreadnoughts and add a MM/PF dread in their place - it's pretty common in Blood Angels artwork.

Cool idea!

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 4:00 pm 
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Indeed, tis in the Salamander list as well.

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 4:24 pm 
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Quote: (Rug @ 11 Jun. 2009, 16:14 )

EUK have remove the shooty dreads in their BA list. Obviously I'd support any similarities!

I may whip out both standard Dreadnought types, instead having the Furisio and the Multi-Melta Dread (as it has more of an Assault bias than the Assault Cannon Dreadnought).

Spliting up D-coy? You know the fluff that each group/band must be lead by a chaplain...

Yeah it's not really workable is it.

I was just thinking of battles on a Warhammer 40,000 scale, where you see a squad of five men attached to a 1500pt army (what Epic would term a formation), and wondering whether that would be workable at Epic scale.

Maybe all formation sizes could be pre-set, so the Tactical formation would be something like:

5 Tactical units and 1 Death Company unit - 350 points.


You'd end up with a liberal scattering of Death Company throughout the whole army, rather than in a single formation...

It's might not be workable but I was just spitballing a new idea.

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Pulsar
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 4:41 pm 
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would all the Death Company units in the army then have to have a chaplain in them? and which formations would get DC if the list did work that way?

but it could be a way to balance the Death Company, worth putting an army list together?

Edit: typing fail




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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 4:56 pm 
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Quote: (Pulsar @ 11 Jun. 2009, 16:41 )

would all the Death Company units in the army then have to have a chaplain in them?

Theoretically, yes.

which formations would get DC if the list did work that way?

I'd assume Tactical and Assault formations.

worth putting an army list together?
No. :)

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 5:11 pm 
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Could make them a chaplains bodyguard in the BA, either adding or replacing a stand. Then no mandatory requirement beyond everyone loves Chaplains and you would see a lot.

Something like Chaplain and Dc bodyguard.
15cm/30cm jump packs, teleport
4+ Invulnerable save
CC3+, +1MWEA
FF4+
Fearless
Replace one unit in formation?

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vytzka
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 5:15 pm 
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That sounds more like Honour Guard to me than Death Company.

There's no absolute requirement that Death Company is accompanied by a Chaplain, or the other way around.
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BlackLegion
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:46 pm 
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Not correct. The Death Company is always led by a Chaplain.

And i support the Multi-melta Dreadnought :)




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vytzka
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 6:42 am 
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Quote: (BlackLegion @ 12 Jun. 2009, 00:46 )

Not correct. The Death Company is always led by a Chaplain.

I checked old 40k codices and it's the case in all but the latest one (I don't have access to the way old Rogue Trader BA list in White Dwarf that wasn't included in any compilations, but I'm not sure that one even had Death Company to begin with). However we already have that with current DC structure.

So both Dreadnoughts would cost 75 points? Maybe that's better than varying pricings between the types, it makes it easier to swap them around (as long as both are worth it).
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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Blood Angels v2.05
PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 11:18 am 
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Well the MM varient is worth somewhere between 50 and 75 points. The Salamanders get away with it being 50 because the thunderhawk is costed at 250 points in the list.

Stats are

Salamander Dreadnought  
Armoured Vehicle, 15cm, Save 4+, CC4+, FF4+
Power Fist, (base contact), Assault Weapon, Extra Attack (+1) Macro-weapon
Multi-melta, 15cm, MW5+, Macro-weapon
AND (15cm), Small Arms, Macro-weapon  
Notes: The Multi-melta can shoot and be used to confer the macro-weapon ability to the unit’s firefight value.

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