Tactical Command
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Necron ability
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=6669		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Flogus [ Wed Mar 29, 2006 11:26 am ]
Post subject:  Necron ability
E:A rules say that only units with blast markers and broken units may rally.

But Necron units without blast marker (but with some killed units) would find useful to attempt a rally. Can they do so to bring some killed units back ?

Should the answer be yes or no, it would be fine to add it to the text of the Necron ability in the next version of the list.
Author:  corey3750 [ Thu Mar 30, 2006 1:56 am ]
Post subject:  Necron ability
I'd never noticed that actually.

but to be honest, it's never really been an issue.  After all, for anyone else, you never need to rally save for if you have BM or are broken
Author:  nealhunt [ Thu Mar 30, 2006 2:13 am ]
Post subject:  Necron ability
The whole rule does have the odd effect that the more suppressed they are, the better they are at rebuilding their units.
Author:  corey3750 [ Sat Apr 01, 2006 4:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Necron ability
Quote (nealhunt @ 30 Mar. 2006 (02:13))
The whole rule does have the odd effect that the more suppressed they are, the better they are at rebuilding their units.

no... it works better the LESS supressed you are.
Author:  Hojyn [ Sun Apr 02, 2006 8:39 am ]
Post subject:  Necron ability
Well, I think the rule works fine and is efficient enough. No need to change the way it works.

Trying to make it better would make it too powerful, in my opinion.
Author:  nealhunt [ Mon Apr 03, 2006 4:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Necron ability
Quote (corey3750 @ 01 April 2006 (16:10))
Quote (nealhunt @ 30 Mar. 2006 (02:13))
The whole rule does have the odd effect that the more suppressed they are, the better they are at rebuilding their units.

no... it works better the LESS supressed you are.

No, Corey, it doesn't.  There is virtually never a reason to remove BMs instead of rebuilding units.  The difference in how many more BMs need to be placed to break the formation is the same so it's better to have more units on the board.

Just for example:

Necron with 0 BMs doesn't get to rally in the end phase and cannot rebuild any units, regardless of previous casualties.

Necron formation with 2 BMs rallies in the end phase, can rebuild up to 1 unit.

Necron formation with 5 BMs rallies in the end phase, can rebuild up to 3 units.
Author:  Hojyn [ Tue Apr 04, 2006 8:51 am ]
Post subject:  Necron ability
Quote (nealhunt @ 03 April 2006 (16:10))
There is virtually never a reason to remove BMs instead of rebuilding units. ?The difference in how many more BMs need to be placed to break the formation is the same so it's better to have more units on the board.

Just for example:

Necron with 0 BMs doesn't get to rally in the end phase and cannot rebuild any units, regardless of previous casualties.

Necron formation with 2 BMs rallies in the end phase, can rebuild up to 1 unit.

Necron formation with 5 BMs rallies in the end phase, can rebuild up to 3 units.

While this is true, I'd also like to point out that rebuilding units is not always the best choice.

Necrons are an assault army, and there are many times when it is better to remove all BMs in order to get the +1 or +2 combat resolution bonus.
Author:  corey3750 [ Fri Apr 07, 2006 12:46 am ]
Post subject:  Necron ability
Quote (nealhunt @ 03 April 2006 (16:10))
Quote (corey3750 @ 01 April 2006 (16:10))
Quote (nealhunt @ 30 Mar. 2006 (02:13))
The whole rule does have the odd effect that the more suppressed they are, the better they are at rebuilding their units.

no... it works better the LESS supressed you are.

No, Corey, it doesn't. ?There is virtually never a reason to remove BMs instead of rebuilding units. ?The difference in how many more BMs need to be placed to break the formation is the same so it's better to have more units on the board.

Just for example:

Necron with 0 BMs doesn't get to rally in the end phase and cannot rebuild any units, regardless of previous casualties.

Necron formation with 2 BMs rallies in the end phase, can rebuild up to 1 unit.

Necron formation with 5 BMs rallies in the end phase, can rebuild up to 3 units.

Perhaps you are seeing things differently than I am.

The main use of the Necron ability is NOT actually in the end phase.  It's in the Marshal ability.

But let's go with your end phase idea here.

Let's use destroyers:

Unit of destroyers loses 2 members (the max it can lose and not break).  In the end phase, they rally and can either restore one dead unit, or remove 1 blast marker.  If they restore the dead unit, they have 5 units, 2 of which are supressed, giving them 3 effective units.  If they remove the blast marker, they have 4 units, 1 of which are suppressed, giving them... 3 effective units.  They haven't increased in combat capability, just durability.

Let's take a bigger example:

Fully loaded Phalanx:  15 units (6 Warriors w/Lord, 3 Spyders, 1 Pariah, 2 Wraiths, 3 Immortals).

Let's say they lost all their close combat units in an assault.  that's 3 dead Spyders, 1 dead Pariah, 2 dead Wraiths, along with a Immortal.  

That's 7 BM on 8 Units.  One short of Breaking.

They rally at the end of the turn, and thus can remove 5 BM (4 for roll, one for Lord).  They can remove 5 BM giving them 8 units, 6 effective units.  Or they can restore the 2 wraiths, and 3 Immortals.  This gives them 13 units... and 6 Effective units.  Again the Combat ability is pretty much unchanged, they are just much tougher to kill.

Now, if the Spyders had survived, and say 3 Warriors had died in their place, you would have a total of 8 BM that could be removed (4 for roll, 1 for Lord, 3 for Spyders).  They could restore the 3 Warriors, 3 Immortals and 2 Wraiths, giving the formation 14 units... and 6 Effective units.


Regardless, the fire combat potential remains unchanged.  The only thing that changes is that the formation is tougher to kill, or finally break.

Which all comes back to the basic anti-Necron tactic:  Pursue a formation until it's destroyed, or at least broken.
Author:  nealhunt [ Fri Apr 07, 2006 2:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Necron ability
Regardless, the fire combat potential remains unchanged.  The only thing that changes is that the formation is tougher to kill, or finally break.


I thought I said that.  Or at least that it was an obvious corrolary to the "same number of BMs to break the formation" comment.

I realize that the post-rally firepower result is the same regardless.  That doesn't change the fact that more BMs = more rebuilding.

In Marshalling, it makes no difference either way.  The same number of units restored/BMs removed regardless of the amount of suppression at the beginning.  The only limit is how many total casualties/BMs you have.

Marshall = neutral.  Rally = more suppressed/more regenerated.  The overall net effect is that they regenerate better when suppressed.


Also, regenerating does more than just make the formation more durable.  Because BMs don't suppress in assaults, the assault ability of the formation goes up.  There is an increased chance of a BM penalty, but lesser chance of being outnumbered.
Author:  corey3750 [ Sun Apr 09, 2006 5:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Necron ability
well, of course there is more regeneration ability Neal, there's more TO regenerate.

If a formation has 1 BM, then it probably hasn't lost anyone.

If it has 4 BM, then it's probably lost 3 guys.

With the exception of Disrupt, the more blast markers they have, the more they have to regenerate.
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