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Necrons in Helsinki tournament
dptdexys
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 4:20 pm 
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One interesting approach I realized during Dobbsy's and Pipboy's fight is attempting to fill your deployment zone with Zones of Control so the Necrons can't get to your juicy units:  Place the majority of your formations directly against your table edge and place scouts formations 12-13cm away, against the forward edge of your deployment zone (perhaps even garrison off your Blitz to allow overwatch setup).  With this type of defense in depth the Monoliths will have to arrive outside your scout screen and will initially have nothing that juicy to attack.


Simliar approach to what is used when trying to stop normal teleporters getting near important units (BTS/Deathstrikes etc.) or forcing Drop pods away from your main troops.

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Chroma
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 4:32 pm 
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(dptdexys @ Feb. 27 2007,15:20)
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Simliar approach to what is used when trying to stop normal teleporters getting near important units (BTS/Deathstrikes etc.) or forcing Drop pods away from your main troops.

And I think it's more effective against Necrons, because Deathwind attacks form Drop pods are going to shred those scout lines in most cases.

Hena, how many games did the Necron player play and which other armies did he face?

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Charad
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 7:20 pm 
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Tau, marines and marines...

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Chroma
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:44 pm 
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(Charad @ Feb. 27 2007,18:20)
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Tau, marines and marines...

Ah... I think the Necron player *really* lucked out there getting *two* Marine opponents.

As usual, Marines have the toughest time fighting "new" armies it seems.

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fbruntz
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:19 am 
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My personnal thougth about this.

1- Like Tyranids, Necrons seem too powerfull when you fight them for the first time.

2- I agree with Hojyn when he says that Monoliths should be limited to 1 per phalanx (in addition I would limit their supports attacks up to 6)

3- Pylons are powerfull but they are easy to break, they are the only AA weapons of the army and there is no Necron air units.

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Charad
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 7:50 am 
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1- Like Tyranids, Necrons seem too powerfull when you fight them for the first time.


True, but in that tournament, games were also necron players first with them...

2- I agree with Hojyn when he says that Monoliths should be limited to 1 per phalanx (in addition I would limit their supports attacks up to 6)

I support this, necron would be fun army to make, but with current rules I would feel bad wielding them unless I face titan legions...

3- Pylons are powerfull but they are easy to break, they are the only AA weapons of the army and there is no Necron air units.

Yep, but good necron player puts them in secure place, so that really ain't that easy. Tk AA attacks are bit rough...

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fbruntz
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:36 am 
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(Charad @ Mar. 01 2007,06:50)
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1- Like Tyranids, Necrons seem too powerfull when you fight them for the first time.


True, but in that tournament, games were also necron players first with them...


That's right but believe me, Necrons are easy to play and you learm much more quickly to use them than to fight them. Indeed you don't have too many ways to ?play them.
In addition, the Necron army list posted at the beginning of the topic shows that the Necron player did know how to play the army even if it was its first ?games.

3- Pylons are powerfull but they are easy to break, they are the only AA weapons of the army and there is no Necron air units.

Yep, but good necron player puts them in secure place, so that really ain't that easy. Tk AA attacks are bit rough...

During the Lyon tournament, my Pylon (I only had one of them) didn't do anything : it was always broken (and once because of the teleportation) or my opponents didn't have a strong air force.
It's so easy to break/destroy it as it is quite fragile and can't move...




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Charad
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:52 am 
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Yes, necrons are much easier to play with, downside is that almost all succesful armies look similar..
And that many armies have serious trouble with them.

And yes, he really know how to use them. :)

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tneva82
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 7:42 pm 
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(Hena @ Mar. 01 2007,08:19)
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True, but 120cm TK AA means that planes can't enter if it exists (unless you are prepared to lose 1 per pylon per turn).

0.5 plane per pylon per turn. No need to assume worse than it actually is...

Well. Except in hands of my friend who likely can manage to keep rolling those 4+'s forever.

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tneva82
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:09 pm 
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(Hena @ Mar. 01 2007,19:00)
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But even if you don't have to prepare for it. As it is 50/50 chance to hit and without 2CD it's a kill as well. With two pylons, I wouldn't even try to put that Thunderhawk into play. With one, there would have to be a very good reason to do it (but I might risk it).

So thunderhawks have bit of hard time doing unsupported air assault? About time they might have to worry about something as doing something about AA BEFORE making air assault...So far there hasn't been much of a reason to fear any AA with any air transport.

It's 2DC. 2 BM and it won't be blowing your thunderhawk up.

Albeit you might to wait a bit until you break it but frankly air assault is too easy to pull off right now anyway...

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Ilushia
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2007 11:30 am 
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Teleporting assault troops are also wonderful for breaking those Pylons. Or any really fast-moving assault troops for that matter. Remember Pylons have NO close combat attacks whatsoever. Assault Marines, Teleporting Terminators, even Tactical Marines in Rhinos have an excellent chance to break or destroy one in an assault if they can get the majority of their unit into base-to-base. Artillery pieces are excellent to break them as well. It does mean you can't do air-assaults all day long with them on the board, and they put significant pressure on WE Aircraft, and aircraft with RA. But they're not particularly better against most attack aircraft then other AA units in the game. They're worse against many then things like Hydras are except for their range, in that they can at best shoot down a single aircraft in a turn while 3 hydras average 2 hits. Since most fighter-craft have 6+ armor saves and only 2-3 models per unit there's a strong chance they'll destroy most or all of a unit of fighters which fly through their air space. I just don't see Pylons being a game-breakingly good item except against enemies who depend on lots of WE-class aircraft for air assaults and don't bring things to get rid of enemy AA without them.
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fbruntz
 Post subject: Necrons in Helsinki tournament
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 12:18 pm 
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(Ilushia @ Mar. 02 2007,10:30)
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Teleporting assault troops are also wonderful for breaking those Pylons. Or any really fast-moving assault troops for that matter. Remember Pylons have NO close combat attacks whatsoever.

Pylon is a war engine, it doesn't need any close assault attack.

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