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Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
nealhunt
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 2:50 pm 
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Hello everyone.

I posted my proposed final language for all the revisions to 4.0.  I think we are pretty much down to tweaks on language as opposed to debating mechanics, but I would still very much like to get people's opinions.

Please check out the threads and comment soon if you wish to have input.  I intend to have the finalized language to Greg by the end of the week.

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Chroma
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 2:58 pm 
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Here's a link: Revised Air Rules

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nealhunt
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 3:14 pm 
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Heh.  I should have done that.  

Thanks.

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Chroma
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 3:25 pm 
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(nealhunt @ Apr. 17 2007,15:14)
QUOTE
Heh. ?I should have done that. ?

Thanks.

No prob, I got your "six".  *laugh*

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orangesm
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:37 pm 
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For reference, the issues under consideration (not in rulebook order) were:
1) Remain on CAP.
2) +1 to CAP/Intercept attacks.
3) BM for "coming under fire" from CAP/Intercept.

Possibly one or more of these:
4) May not capture/contest on the same turn as it lands (GT-specific rule).
5) May not fire AA on the same turn as it lands.
6) Targetting mod to prevent sniping (possibly just sidebar).
7) Ground flak may only fire during End Phase if it Sustained Fire or is on OW.
8) Planetfall triggering OW [recent addition]

1) Makes CAP sorta like OW.
2) I assume this is meant to make aircraft more accurate against other aircraft,  but hitting ground targets is normally easier.
3) Agree

4) Agree
5) Disagree here - the aircraft could continue to fire its self defense weapons as it lands, which is what the not being able to contest/capture represents - the aircraft landing.
6) I think this represents how the aircraft would be firing well -  they fire on approach to the target and may overfly the target.
7) The -1 for end phase AA I think is great because it helps to counter the Flak Rush to attack something like a Thunderhawk or Marauder as it is exiting the table.   This helps to balance out versus the new restrictions on the Lander aircraft.
8) Agree

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Moscovian
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:48 pm 
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I agree with it in toto.  While on a point-by-point I find some issues, I don't think a better compromise can be reached.

Think about it, the original rules didn't make everyone happy, so there is no reason to think the revised ones will.  These clarifications will make most people happier with the rules and that is all we can ask for.

Good job cranking that out.   :)

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Dwarf Supreme
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:50 pm 
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I like all of these changes. I agree with Moscovian: you might not be able to please everyone, but I think these revisions will make most people happier.

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CyberShadow
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 5:15 pm 
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I generally agree with all of these, although point four doesnt go as far as I would like it to it is a step in the right direction.

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nealhunt
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:19 pm 
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Thanks guys.

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Pulsar
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:24 pm 
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only just found this post, had a read and i like the changes.

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mageboltrat
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 7:05 pm 
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The only one I'm not sure on is #5. The only army you see using this is Space Marines, and even then not very often. I don't see the need to nerf it.

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nealhunt
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 7:53 pm 
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Ratty:  I left it alone.  I've only heard a few reports of it happening and I figured the -1 in the end phase if the aircraft has moved would slow it down.

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orangesm
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 2:55 pm 
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What defines Aircraft in Epic?  Is it a speed thing?  This is going to complicate the matter, but right now there are aircraft that stay on the table the entire game as skimmers (Vultures, Valkyries, and Mantas).  What if a player wanted to have their Marauder Destroyer lotter to provide close air support during a fire fight?

Can a flying Thunderhawk lend its FF to an attack on the ground?  If so should not all aircraft get a FF value?

I realize this may be out there, but I think there are some ideas that are on the flip side of the coin - and give a reason to keep aircraft on the table and make them worthwhile to have.

Focus on the ground war, allow the aircraft to support the ground war.

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Moscovian
 Post subject: Air Rules Posted on SG Boards
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 6:30 pm 
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(orangesm @ Apr. 19 2007,09:55)
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Can a flying Thunderhawk lend its FF to an attack on the ground? ?If so should not all aircraft get a FF value?

Orangesm, I have often had similar thoughts.  While I am fine with Neal's proposed changes, I think the idea of an alternate set of air rules (also proposed by Neal) would be a good idea.  

In those rules, I'd like to see answers to some of the points you brought up.  Thunderhawks and Vampires can act like vultures and valkries in all respects, so they COULD be treated like skimmers IMO.

But bear in mind these changes were an attempt to refine and improve the existing air rules.  I think anything that steps away from that mission will undoubtedly derail the rules review further (if that is possible)...  :(

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