Tactical Command
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Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terrain?
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=21844		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  etriustremere [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:45 am ]
Post subject:  Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terrain?
Hi!

I was reading the masterFAQ, and I got in doubt about one rule, as written:

Can a skimmer end his movement over any sort of terrain and declare that it's hovering high enough not to benefit from any cover... but equally not do any dangerous terrain test and being able to finish over impassable terrain?

If it's a YES (I don't think so),
How do you assault it (obviously you can when over 15cm in impassable terrain)?
How does he trace LoF? How do you to it?

Where is this clarified? It happened (unimportantly) on the table today. and I'd like to clarify for the future.
Author:  Signal [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
Nope. Skimmers can be "Popped Up," but it only counts for shooting purposes, and ends at the end of their activation (with the exception of overwatch.) There is no option which allows them to remain that high, which is why it isn't allowed.
Author:  zombocom [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 10:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
No, skimmers cannot finish movement over impassible terrain, and if they end on dangerous terrain they must take a test.
Author:  asdepicas [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 12:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
Quote:
2.1.13 Skimmer

General Commentary: The skimmer rules and FAQs have been addressed a number of times. However, they remain a source of confusion as each iteration of the rules have had wording that, taken literally, does note accurately reflect the intent. There are two criteria for judging the intended effects of the skimmer rule:
1) Popping up counts as movement (with the exception of going onto OW).
2) Skimmers which get the benefits of being “in” the terrain are required to take terrain checks.

For #1, if you can move, you can pop up. This includes moves that aren’t actually during an action, like countercharges.
For #2, this means that if you are loading troops or claiming any sort of cover modifier you have to enter the terrain and make appropriate terrain checks.


my wrong, i had read the #2 that while i didnt claimed any sort of cover or loaded any troops i didnt have to enter the terrain so would be considered to be hovering over the terrain. maybe this sentence in the faq should be clarified (maybe its just my sleepy mind wich need being "clarified")
Author:  Mephiston [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 1:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
Maybe add

"#3. A skimmer always starts, and ends, its activation on the ground."
Author:  etriustremere [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 1:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
Yes, I saw were was your thought coming from when re-read the FAQ, asdepicas. I also think rewording won't hurt. The 3# proposed by Mephiston sounds good to me. I'd add indeed:

3# A skimmer always starts and finishes it's movement on the ground (and checks for dangerous terrain, if any).
Author:  Kyrt [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
Is it not that each move ends its movement on the ground? (i.e. if you march you make 3 moves, each of which you must take a dangerous terrain test if you are in dangerous terrain at the start/end of the move).
Author:  Mephiston [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
Not really. As per the FAQ you may pop up on a counter charge to gain line of site as part of a counter charge, and to be able to fight you have to maintain this until the engagement ends. So it is start of activation to end of activation.
Author:  zombocom [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
Well, technically popping-up has nothing to do with dangerous terrain tests. Popping-up is solely for line of sight rules, so, again technically, it is possible to be popped-up and still take dangerous terrain tests as you move.

Rules are silly.
Author:  Ulrik [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
Worth a FAQ maybe?
Author:  Mephiston [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
lol, skimmer is already one of the larger FAQ sections :)
Author:  Ulrik [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
Mephiston wrote:
lol, skimmer is already one of the larger FAQ sections :)


And the questions still pop up.

Reading the rulebook I, at least, would assume that skimmers test for every move, not every action. If it's supposed to be only at the end of the activation (based on a convoluted reading of the popup rules involving skimmers popping up when countercharging), how does that not belong in the FAQ?
Author:  Mephiston [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
[quote]For #2, this means that if you are loading troops or claiming any sort of cover modifier you have to enter the terrain and make appropriate terrain checks.[quote]

This part of the FAQ covers that already. If your going to either interact with non skimmer units, or claim cover, you have to test. If not you just move on.

So with the suggested #3 addition above I think the op's questions are covered?
Author:  asdepicas [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
probably yes
Author:  etriustremere [ Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Can skimmers end their activation hovering way over terr
Just a rewrite as per last thoughts:

3# A skimmer always finishes it's movement on the ground (and checks for dangerous terrain, if any).

(I think that checking at the start and end of a turn is not very consistent, as you check for getting in danger, so most probably having to perform two tests is not very fair: one is to risky most of the time, already)
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