Tactical Command :: View topic - Tunneller

Tunneler

Tunnellers are set up touching their own side's table edge before the battle starts at the same time that spacecraft are setup (see EA 4.3.1). Any units transported in the tunneller should be placed to one side at this time too.

Secretly write down the location where the tunneller will surface at the same time and in the same manner that you record the coordinates of a drop zone (see EA 4.3.1). You must also secretly record when the tunneller will surface. If it is going to surface in your half of the table it may arrive from the second turn onwards. If it is going to surface in the opposing half of the table, it may arrive from turn three onwards.

Set up the tunneller at the start of the stated turn, before placing units with teleport, at the location you wrote down. Any units being transported are allowed to disembark immediately upon surfacing. Surfacing does not count as movement for the purposes of triggering overwatch fire. Disembarking triggers overwatch fire as normal.

If the tunneler surfaces on terrain that is impassable for it, under a friendly unit, or in an enemy zone of control then it is assumed that on-board sensor equipment will divert it towards another entry point. The unit should be moved by the opposing player to the nearest area where it can surface.

Formations of multiple tunnelers need only record one location where they will surface. Place the first unit on this location, all other units must be placed within 5cm of another unit that has already been placed and on the appropriate half of the table.

Tunnellers, and any units being transported in them, may take an action on the turn they appear.

Author:	frogbear [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 10:59 am ]
Post subject:	Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
Current rule: Quote: If the tunneller is going to appear in the friendly half of the table it can be slated to arrive from turn two onwards. If it is slated to arrive in the enemy half of the table it can arrive anywhere from turn three onward. Is there any plausible reason that with the level of the game today that Tunneller is still used as a Turn 3 play? In all honesty, it will most likley be coming up out of the Blitz and you do one of two things, forget the Blitz, or Overwatch and wait for it. IMO it is such a boring and unimaginative rule. It leaves nothing in the way of drama or suspense. MorganVening came up with the below rule which provides some strategy back to the player and provides a better choice of options: Quote: When planning arrival, if a Tunneler formation will enter play on the opponent's half of the table, it must be Turn 2 or later. If it enters play within 45cm of the opponent's Blitz, it must be Turn 3 or later. Before people start talking about balance, we have playtested this version and we found no issue. What it does allow is a 2nd turn appearance on the filed of battle where it will actually matter. Are we going to be stuck on the old rule and not be open to new ideas?

Author:	Moscovian [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 12:54 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
Being this rule effects three of the four lists in the Xenos book, I have a particular interest in it. Other than a lack of imagination as you put it, do you see any balance issues with the rule as it is? There are some other issues with the tunneler rule that we need to address, so I'll keep this thread in the back of my mind when we start to mull those over.

Author:	zombocom [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 12:59 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
Equally, I'd like to see the rule reworked to be able to work for units of tunnellers as well as single transport tunnellers, as that's pretty essential for the tyranids.

Author:	The_Real_Chris [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 1:55 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
I thought it was a varient of planetfall? I.e. Plot entry points for each tunneller unit. If the transport vehicle is alive, not broken and when they surface and hasn't moved that turn they don't scatter, if its dead they do. Slow and steady and the like is then applied to the tunneling vehicle. So termites nothing, removed after surfacing. Hellbores get slow and steady and are persistant.

Author:	Moscovian [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:36 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
We really should strive for a universal tunnel rule. Zombocom rightly points out there are some differences in how the rule affects the Squats and Tyranids. Currently the Tyranid Onachus list and the Squat/Demiurg lists use different language.

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Author:	Dave [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 3:11 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
Ya, we're definitely going to need to use the same language. I took a stab at it for the reason Zombo stated and to clear up the placing how/when issues. This is what's in Onachus, it's the rulebook Tunneler plus clarification. Quote: Tunneler Tunnellers are set up touching their own side's table edge before the battle starts at the same time that spacecraft are setup (see EA 4.3.1). Any units transported in the tunneller should be placed to one side at this time too. Secretly write down the location where the tunneller will surface at the same time and in the same manner that you record the coordinates of a drop zone (see EA 4.3.1). You must also secretly record when the tunneller will surface. If it is going to surface in your half of the table it may arrive from the second turn onwards. If it is going to surface in the opposing half of the table, it may arrive from turn three onwards. Set up the tunneller at the start of the stated turn, before placing units with teleport, at the location you wrote down. Any units being transported are allowed to disembark immediately upon surfacing. Surfacing does not count as movement for the purposes of triggering overwatch fire. Disembarking triggers overwatch fire as normal. If the tunneler surfaces on terrain that is impassable for it, under a friendly unit, or in an enemy zone of control then it is assumed that on-board sensor equipment will divert it towards another entry point. The unit should be moved by the opposing player to the nearest area where it can surface. Formations of multiple tunnelers need only record one location where they will surface. Place the first unit on this location, all other units must be placed within 5cm of another unit that has already been placed and on the appropriate half of the table. Tunnellers, and any units being transported in them, may take an action on the turn they appear.

Author:	zombocom [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 3:34 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
That allows quite a long spread out from the tunnel for tunnelling formations. I'd add a caveat that all tunneling units must be placed within 15cm of the tunnel marker.

Author:	Dave [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 3:41 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
Perhaps, but you can do the same with a Teleport formation and that's not pre-plotted. Has there been issues with something like Flayed Ones (scouts) abusing this ability? Or are you concerned more on a fluff/explanation level?

Author:	zombocom [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 3:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
Dave wrote: Perhaps, but you can do the same with a Teleport formation and that's not pre-plotted. Has there been issues with something like Flayed Ones (scouts) abusing this ability? Or are you concerned more on a fluff/explanation level? Teleporters require 5cm coherency even for scouts actually, so flayed ones make no difference. It's more for nids I'm thinking, where you could have a large formation of Trygons and Raveners that are supposed to come out of the same hole, somehow spread out in a long line.

Author:	Dave [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 4:00 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
Whoops, you're right. The tunnelers would have to be within 5cm coherency as well though (due to the placement rules). This sounds like the latter of the two concerns, however. Do we have to assume they're coming out of the same hole? Squads of Raveners and Trygons can Deep Strike independently of one another in 40k, I take that to mean that they're all coming out where they want and not one tunnel.

Author:	Moscovian [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 4:36 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
We can safely assume that the come out of the same network of holes, based on the fictions. In Brood War they burrow together IIRC, meaning that they are working together as a team. It also means we can keep things the same for the Squats who will undoubtedly need to come out in close proximity to each other.

Author:	Evil and Chaos [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 4:40 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
I'd echo Zombo's concern, in that allowing "chaining out" with the invariably large Tyranid formations would result in making the pre-plotting fairly meaningless.

Author:	Dave [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 4:41 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
Given the 'nids strategy rating I'd much rather keep them close together too, otherwise you're just asking for a clipping assault at the start of the turn. A 15cm radius is a huge area, I haven't even come close to using that much space when placing tunnelers. Most have been within a 15cm diameter.

Author:	zombocom [ Wed Nov 10, 2010 5:13 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Tunneller - Rework, rework, rework.
Dave wrote: A 15cm radius is a huge area, I haven't even come close to using that much space when placing tunnelers. Most have been within a 15cm diameter. Exactly, it shouldn't limit any normal placement in the slightest, just stop people stretching them out in a conga line.

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