Tactical Command
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Silly Debate
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=3608		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Cuban Commissar [ Fri Dec 02, 2005 11:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
Ok So here is my current minis debate.

I'm pretty much knee deep into the 40K universe. In terms of armies here is the list.

BFG:
Imperial (large)
Space Marine (Dark Angel)

Epic:
Imperial (Large)
Space Marine (Dark Angel)

40K:
Cadian Mechanized
Space Marine (Dark Angel)

Now for the longest time I just thought that for a home brewed campaign I would send my IG against my Marines.  I imgained that such a campaign would represent a conflict during the Age of Apostasy, in essence an Imperial civil war.  

But the more I think on it the more I feel my Imperial forces should have a proper bad guy army.  Allowing these loyal Imperial forces to work togethor as opposed to against each other.  But which one.

For the record let me cross the following options of the list.
Eldar (any kind)
Chaos (any kind)
Tau
Nids

So this really leaves two choices in my mind.  Orks and another human army, just not Imperial.

They both have apeals and I'm having trouble deciding.  So would anyone what to throw there 2 cents in.

Here is my summary of the pros and cons.  Of cource please remember that this decision involves 3 games systems.  

Orks:

Pros:
Different play style from current armies...assault vs shooty
Can fight anyone anywhere
A vast array of modeling oppurtunities

Cons:
They basic ork models don't exacly appeal to me.  Orks would involve a great deal conversion.

Bad IG:
aka "Some planetary Governer's personel agenda no longer matchs that of the Imperium"

Pros:
Cool story/Campaign potential.  In essence some great leader has taken over and is carving up his own peice of the galaxy; perhaps a Fallen Angel.
Challenge of developing an IG force using a different look and tactics from the Cadians.  This will be a infantry heavy force.  GW will release Vahallans/Steel Legion in the future so they can be the basis of this force.

Cons:
Another "IG" army

so what do you guys think?
Author:  Chroma [ Sat Dec 03, 2005 12:01 am ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
What about Necrons?
Author:  Cuban Commissar [ Sat Dec 03, 2005 12:15 am ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
Quote (Chroma @ 02 Dec. 2005 (23:01))
What about Necrons?

Well I didn't say no to them did I :D



I see Necrons more as a raider force as oopsed to planettary occupation.  I want a long drawn out campaign to work with as the background.  The only forces I imagine that can sustain a long war is a human force, chaos, Tau, and Orks.  all the other armies are hit and run.  

Something I love about the Guant's Ghost novels is the sense of a much larger conflict than just want is happening to the characters.  It really brings the "scale" of 40K warfare to the forefront and that is great.
Author:  Chroma [ Sat Dec 03, 2005 12:26 am ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
Quote (Cuban Commissar @ 02 Dec. 2005 (23:15))
I see Necrons more as a raider force as oopsed to planettary occupation. ?I want a long drawn out campaign to work with as the background. ?The only forces I imagine that can sustain a long war is a human force, chaos, Tau, and Orks. ?all the other armies are hit and run.

What if the Necron menace was *from* the Imperial planet?  An old Stasis Crypt accidentally opened by well-meaning Explorators.  Starts with raids... where are these metal aliens coming from?  And slowly the attack grows larger as the population begins to be harvested and the Imperials struggle to turn back the metallic tide... I think there's campaign potential there.  

Even allows for potential Kill Team and EPIC/Gothic games!
Author:  Cuban Commissar [ Sat Dec 03, 2005 12:39 am ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
Good idea worth thinking about...
Author:  dafrca [ Sat Dec 03, 2005 9:46 am ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
Two Qustions:

1) Why did you nix the other races from Epic?

2) Does your new army need to be an official GW army?

dafrca
Author:  vanvlak [ Sat Dec 03, 2005 12:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
Cons:
They basic ork models don't exacly appeal to me.  Orks would involve a great deal conversion.

That's not a con, that's the clincher. Orks! :D :p :D :D
Author:  Cuban Commissar [ Sat Dec 03, 2005 6:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
Quote (dafrca @ 03 Dec. 2005 (08:46))
Two Qustions:

1) Why did you nix the other races from Epic?

2) Does your new army need to be an official GW army?

dafrca

Well Dafrca the answer to the first question is complex.

Why Doesn't Louie like army "X"  Please take no affront if you have these armies these are just my very personal and very baised opinions.

Eldar -
The Imperial Commissar Reason:  Manipulative Pansies!  Why won't you just die already.  Thanks to you we have 4 chaos gods to deal with as opposed to 3.  We needed that like we need another whole in space.  And every time we fight you we always hear "This was forseen in the stones!"  Aggh!
Real Reason:  While the Eldar background story is cool the models never really appealed to me and the playing style wasn't me.  I don't to subtle.  Also my goof freind plays Eldar I could never take his army.

Chaos -
The Imperial Commissar Reason:  The arch enemy.  The greatetst threat humaity faces.  Any taint must be purged with extreme prejudice.
Real reason:  They're the bad guys I don't too bad guys. Chaos is gross and evil.  Not comfortable with the whole deamon thing either; I just feel dirty even touching a mini of a great unclean one.  Why would any one willing choose nugle.  Really that is just wrong.  I just don;t get it ???

Tau-
The Imperial Commissar Reason: You pathetic upstarts if we won't fighting for our very lives over here we would gather our forces and the Tau empire would be another footnote of some usless historical lexicon buried in some imperial archive.  You want to help the greater good.  Hold off the tyranids while we send the Ultramarines and all their sucessor chapter straight into the eye of terror.  Now that would most diffenently serve the greater good.   :D
The real reason:  While having some of the coolest models I just couldn't bring myself to play them.  Both my curent armies reside on the opposite side of the 40K galaxy map.  Also I just won;t feel right fighting tau.  They are the only reall "good guys" in this whole place.  When my space marines fight tau we are no longer humanities greatets heros we become man evil enforces of imperial prejudice and fear.      :p

As for the second question I would consider going "outside the box"

Right now I'm leaning toward the orks.  I found the Blood Axe army list for 40K and the list has real appeal to me.  I can take 3 looted vehicles.  One Leman Russ, one Basilisk, and one Griffon motor sounds really cool right now.  Along with unlimted commandos.  yeah I like that
Author:  vanvlak [ Sat Dec 03, 2005 6:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
Yay - orks 1, rest of the galaxy 0 :D
They're also fun!
And - entertaining reply, Commissar! :D :D
Author:  dafrca [ Sun Dec 04, 2005 5:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
CC,

Based on your answers then I too would look toward the GZG line or a few of the other 6mm SciFi and find a figure you like and then build the army around them.

True that Orks take a lot of conversions and if you do not like the vehicles now, you may loose interest quickly.

dafrca
Author:  MaksimSmelchak [ Sun Dec 04, 2005 6:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
Hi Luis,

I'm thinking that Orkz, Necrons or "Traitor" IG are your best bet.

Maybe Adler's Khiff (wolf/dog-like aliens) would be cool!

Gladiator also makes cool worm aliens that I think look remarkably like the old Star Frontiers Sathar.

There are lots of options.

Shalom,
Maksim-Smelchak.
Author:  Cuban Commissar [ Sun Dec 04, 2005 8:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
I think I have found subsitutes for all the ork vehciles I don't like.

For example I don't like the Stompas and the Gargants.  But I think I can use battletech mechs for those with some conversions.

I didn't like epic ork battlewagons and gun wagons.  Once again battletech has enough I do like to use as replacements.

I actualy like all the Gothic ork ships especially the escorts.  No replacement needed there.

All the 40K vehciles will be kitbashed so don't need to use the standards there.

As for the base 40K ork grunt.  That I have to live with.  I did see where I can get some classic Kommandos so that will help.  Maybe if I can find someone with green stuff experience we can do something.  

We'll see
Author:  Tas [ Mon Dec 05, 2005 10:11 am ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
If you dont like the existing ork figs - what about going for Feral Orks?
Thats quite a different look and allows pretty much anything you like!
Author:  Cuban Commissar [ Mon Dec 05, 2005 6:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Silly Debate
Thanks Tas, But is going in the wrong direction.  I want more clothed orks as opposed to the universal leather jerkin/Armor plates.  

But I just brought my first box set so I'm doomed now.   :D
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