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Marines with few infantry - need advice
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Author:  Guardian [ Sun Nov 23, 2003 5:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
At the moment i only play Battlefleet Gothic

I used to play normal 40k but found it boring and to easy

I am think of now moving into epic aswell and i was wondering what it is like and have few questions:

1)What are the pointvaules like i hear they are diffrent?

2)How does it play eg. like normal 40k

3)How much are titans and how many points do i need before i could get one

4)Whats a average amounts of points and troops

5)What armies are there eg. same as normal 40k or more or less
Author:  Legion 4 [ Sun Nov 23, 2003 7:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
Well I'll throw out a few of the answers.  Epic, no matter what version, plays somewhat differently than 40K.  40K Rules are terrible.  You can get as big or as small an army as you want, based on who you are going to play, and most armies do include a Titan or two.  The current Epic Armies are SM, IG, Ork, Eldar, 'Nids, Chaos, plus F/W Tau & Kroot and for us "old timers" the Squats.   Average points for an Army is around 2000-3000, roughly ...  :;):
Author:  Warmaster Nice [ Sun Nov 23, 2003 8:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
For a balanced army you'd probably need closer to 3000 pt to include a titan. ...But then again this also varies depending on which army you play.
Grand Tournament Armies willl be either 2500 or 3000 but personally I prefer games at arround 5000 as they allow you to field more titans:p

The most expensive titan in E:A so far is the Eldar Warlock Titan at 1000 pt. A warlord is 850, Reaver 650 and Warhounds 250 a piece.
Ork Great gargants cost 850 and normal gargants 650.
It's been a while since I read the Tyranid List but as i recall their Titans were among the cheapest in the game.

I haven't played 40k since 2nd edition so unfortunately I cannot tell you the points difference between that and epic.
Epic is more about strategy whereas 40k allows much more cheese and ?ber-units. In epic no single unit will ever win you a game which I thinks makes a more interesting and challenging game.

Cheers.
Author:  Guardian [ Sun Nov 23, 2003 8:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
Cheers

I think it sounds a really entertaining game

I'll give it good consideration
Author:  primarch [ Sun Nov 23, 2003 10:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
Hi!

In 40k you worry about individual models and such. In epic you command platoons, companies or even battalions. Epic has models that could never be realistically fielded in a 40k battle, like titan battlegroups, whole companies of tanks and artillery and even squadrons of fliers. It gives you a "grand battle" feel unlike 40k which is a skirmish game. They are games at opposite ends of the scale of conflict.

Primarch
Author:  TuffSkull [ Fri Feb 27, 2004 8:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
Hi guys,

I'm still relatively unexperienced in actual gaming for E:A, so I'm turning to you for some advice as usual :D

I've been thinking this afternoon & decided that with all thenew models that are coming out, I'm going to put together a small marine army. From the gaming I have done, I belive that tactical detachments are simple one of the best units in the game & have advised a number of players to take a good share of any army in simple tactical detachments.

HOWEVER,
Now I'm looking to do my own army (tournament sized - 2700points) & I'm going to be very limited on the infantry I can field (for reasons that cannot be disclosed at this time).

I'm currently looking at:
1 Tactical detachment, Supreem commander, Hunter ? ? ? ?475
Terminator detachment + 2 drednoughts for flavour ? ? ? ? ?425
Scout detachment + sniper ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?175
Biker detachment ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 200
Predator Detachment ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?300
Land Raider Detachment ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?400
Warhound Titan ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 250

So far that totals 2225points, so I have 475 to play with.

Without adding any more infantry other than terminators, what would you suggest to make this a viable army capable of being competitive?

I want to get another hunter in there to see off enemy airpower, and am pondering a detachment of whirlwinds, but havent seen those in action yet under the new rules.

Any thoughts much appreciated, although I may not be able to reply again for a while - I'm hitting the slopes for a bit of skiing from tommorrow for 7 nights ?:cool:
Author:  mr_mich [ Fri Feb 27, 2004 8:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
I'm by far the farthest you can get from an E:A marine expert, but if I had some advice it'd be the following.

I understand your dreadnaughts will go with the terminators for flavor, but that just seems like a bad place to put them, as they'll really slow down the terminators and they may never get to see assault.  That would be a true travesty.  If you're not giving transports to the tactical squad, maybe the dreadnaughts could go there?

Aircraft may or may not be your thing, it seems to me like a love/hate thing.  You might want to check out some aircraft of some sort.

Another warhound might be a good idea, seeing as in 2700 points only one titan will be a magnet for all the TK and MW fire you can imagine.

Just a few suggestions, and I can't wait until you can disclose those reasons.  :D
Author:  Markconz [ Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
Aren't standard tournament armies going to be 3000 points?  :o

My advice is to take whirlwinds with another hunter... reason being you have much anti-armour capability but little anti-infantry capability.  Keep your two hunters close to give overlapping air cover.

Not taking more infantry except termies seems strange, but more terminators would be ok, I'd ditch the dreads from your terminators, as they can't teleport I believe.

Also a little airpower might not hurt...

BTW did you get the e-mail I sent you?
Author:  CrimsonFury [ Fri Feb 27, 2004 11:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
Quote (Markconz @ 27 2004 Feb.,20:30)
Aren't standard tournament armies going to be 3000 points? ?:o

No. 2700 points was deciced upon during the tournament trial runs.

It was choosen because it keeps the amount of models required down, and the play time down (to make sure tournament matches get completed in time), while still allowing players to take a large titan if they want.

With the 1\3 limiation on titans and aircraft, you get 900 points to spend on them. That means if you take one of the large titan (850 points) you can't afford any aircraft. It forces players to choose their WE\aircraft mixture more carefully.
Author:  Legion 4 [ Sat Feb 28, 2004 6:35 am ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
Intriguing ... I can't wait to find out why you are limited on Infantry.  That being said ... I agree with some of the suggestions ... Whirlwinds, Hunter and maybe some aircraft.   :;):
Author:  CyberShadow [ Sat Feb 28, 2004 11:27 am ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
Everyone here knows my limited knowledge of Marines, but I would add some Land Speeders for some MW hits. Possibly more armour, whether that is in the form of another Warhound or some tanks such as Vindicators scattered around is up to you.
Author:  CrimsonFury [ Sat Feb 28, 2004 7:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
A few things to say about SM armoured formations:

IMO vindicator formations are the least useful formation in the SM army. Invidiual vindicators as upgrades are sometimes useful (mainly for an extra unit to absorb hits\BMs and add an extra FF attack).

I think predators are one of the most under-appriceated tank formations (particularly predator annihilators). While they may not be that tough compared to land raiders or leman russes, they pack awesome firepower for thier points cost. They're quite fast too, which gives thems the abilitly to react quickly to distant threats. On double orders they can reach a target 105cm from their starting point with 4x AT5+ shots and 8x AT6+ shots (thats after the -1 modifer for double orders).

Land raiders I only ever use as transports for terminators or devastators. As purely tank formation I don't think they're worth 400 points.

As someone else mentioned, I wouldn't put the dreads with the terminators. Dreads slow the formation down to much. I would only put dreads with formations I was going to garrison to sit on objectives.

Also don't forget that terminators can teleport anywhere on the table if you don't take any transports or additonal units.
Author:  Legion 4 [ Sun Feb 29, 2004 5:33 am ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
Yes, since Terminators can Teleport and Assault Marines have jump packs, we rarely ever give them transport.  As I said we have been using activation since SM1.  And we never use mixed dets. except with troops being transported and that is generally temporary.  Tank/AFV formations activate separately, as do Infantry, FA, etc. in our system.  It is simpler and stops unit from being large mixed formations.  But that is our opinion, we never planned on playing E:A "out of the box" ...  :;):
Author:  Tas [ Sun Feb 29, 2004 10:34 am ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
I agree with all the above comments, espec. the ones about the dreadies with the termies, the LRaiders and adding Landspeeders.

I would also stick your one and only grunt unit into Razorbacks.  This spreads them out a lot more to make that formation more robust, plus only 1 stand of inf gets lost with each vehicle, rather than 2.  With few sets of legs, this will probably become important.

Intriged about why you cant add more grunts though, and looking forward to finding out!

Hope this helps
Tas
Author:  bloodman [ Sun Feb 29, 2004 8:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Marines with few infantry - need advice
tuff, you are using the FW mutli part infantry aren't you
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