Tactical Command
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Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=30728		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  WARDUKE [ Tue Jan 05, 2016 3:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
Hi all,

Trying to get back into Epic and have been searching around the web for a few days now and reading through posts on the forums here. I am a little confused about the various editions available and sorting out what is what.

I originally started playing with the Epic 40k boxed set, and later purchased the Epic Armageddon Rulebook when it came it. I know there are some differences between the two, but I see NetEpic and NetEpic Armageddon out there, and was wondering how these are different (from the GW versions), and how?

Also curious if both are supported by Heresy era rules, and what I might find different between the editions. Any basic summary of the different editions would be great - Or, if there is somewhere that you can point me where this might already exists, I would appreciate it. Also interested in which game seems to get the most fan support these days?

Thanks.
Author:  kyussinchains [ Tue Jan 05, 2016 4:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
We seriously need a sticky to explain this stuff!

Netepic is a continuation of second edition space marine/titan legions, 2nd edition of the game

Net Epic Armageddon is not a ruleset, it is a bunch of fan developed army lists

The ruleset is simply called Epic Armageddon and is used by all the various groups (NetEA/EpicUK/EpicAU etc) it is the same ruleset in the book published in 2006
Author:  jimmyzimms [ Tue Jan 05, 2016 4:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
Yup.
NetEpic==Totally new game though mechanics are based on 2nd edition.
NetEA==Lists, an FAQ integrated version of the GW rulebook, and supplements (http://www.net-armageddon.org/page/fan-supplements)
Author:  WARDUKE [ Tue Jan 05, 2016 4:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
Thanks for the replies.

So there is 2nd Edition which NetEpic is a continuation of (Space Marine/Titan Legions).

Then, the Tactical Command forums break down into two forums: Epic 40k and Epic Armageddon. The former being the 3rd edition of the rules, and the latter being the 2006 Specialist Games version used as the basis for NetEA/EpicUK/EpicAU.

Is that a moderately correct summary?

What are the major (bullet point) differences between NetEpic (2nd Edition SM/Titan Legions) vs Epic 40k vs Epic Armageddon?
Author:  kyussinchains [ Tue Jan 05, 2016 5:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
Its not really as easy as breaking it down into bullet points, 2nd edition was an entitely different beast to the later editions which were re-written from the ground up.... its not like 40k where the rules are basically the same from one edition to the next....
Author:  jimmyzimms [ Tue Jan 05, 2016 5:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
yeah all 4 editions of Epic are completely different games. They just use the same models.

a few notes about the last 3 versions:

-2nd/NetEpic: Lots of detail (down to bolters having individual attacks). Wealth of units available. Long range weapons relative to table size. Uses detachment/company cards system. Has a long track record of quality professional looking releases. Games often run longer than other versions (again, detail). Interestingly, many people have used 28mm models with this rule set as 40k is basically crap.

3rd: If you've played BFG then you basically get Epic 40k. Extremely flexible army building system. Very abstracted. Can tackle extremely large games in reasonable time and is focused on a higher level of "generalship". More of a bad rap than deserved and has some very elegant design. Introduced the suppression system into epic games.

4th: Very maneuver combat and suppression orientated. generally relies on achieving various victory conditions instead of curb stomping the opposing army. More detail than 3rd, far less than 2nd. Has a very healthy international tournament scene and considered very well balanced. Far more restricted army building system based on lists that are highly themed (eg Marine Tank Army, Mechanized Inf Imperial Guard, Defensive Siege marines, Panzer Elves :) etc)
Author:  GlynG [ Tue Jan 05, 2016 5:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
I don't have time to reply properly but I'd recommend looking at Epic Armageddon. It's my favourite wargame and the most popular and regularly played and talked about version. There are a dozen or so EpicA tournaments around the UK each year, but I've never heard of a tournament for either of the other systems.
Author:  Kyrt [ Wed Jan 06, 2016 4:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
Yes this does come up a lot and it's complicated and confusing unfortunately. Cybershadow (site admin) did want to setup a forum guide that would include stickies to explain this type of thing, and in the thread to discuss that I mentioned that in the past I put together a diagram to describe the timeline of the various Epic versions:
http://www.taccmd.tacticalwargames.net/ ... ea#p479228
This was supposed to go on the NetEA website but I think CS felt it should go here instead (but as yet we still lack something comprehensive).

The diagram would need to be updated as the NetEA compendium is not a good thing to direct people to now, and also no mention of some of the other community efforts like FERC.
Author:  Blip [ Wed Jan 06, 2016 6:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
That is a great diagram (even accepting it limitations.) In some ways any more detail would over complicate it - after all the French and other options (afaik) only occurs in EA and therefore it's still relevant as is. Just call it "English language" epic progression and get it out there !
Author:  Kyrt [ Fri Jan 08, 2016 11:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
My opinion is unchanged, I think it's worth having an explanation on the NetEA website about what the difference between the major versions is, including a diagram. It's all very well saying it should be somewhere else instead (debateable of course), but such a thing does not actually exist.

However, although I have administrative control over the NetEA website and I'm happy to add it, I think this is an editorial question for the ERC.
Author:  StevekCole [ Fri Jan 08, 2016 1:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
I kind of think this clarification should be on every site that has anything to do with epic. I'll make sure the updated London website gets changed. It was definitely confusing as he'll for me to work out which version did what when I was getting into epic a couple of years ago.
Author:  carlisimo109 [ Sat Jan 09, 2016 1:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
Just give the diagram a separate color for army lists, with a legend pointing it out. They should come out the side of the rules box, not below. Don't forget the Horus Heresy lists! If the baby sleeps in his crib tonight (unlikely) I'll take a stab at it. Crudely, though. I don't have any software that's really meant for it. I'd also have 3rd ed. coming from out of nowhere, not from 2nd.

jimmyzimms wrote:
NetEA==Lists, an FAQ integrated version of the GW rulebook, and supplements (http://www.net-armageddon.org/page/fan-supplements)


NetEA also claims to handle rules clarifications, and I don't think it's only through the FAQ. Someone using an early Epic: Armageddon rulebook plus the NetEA FAQ would be missing something, wouldn't they?

So now we have to explain that NetEpic and Net Epic Armageddon (nomenclature used on the website) are completely different and that's not intuitive. Maybe we could help by always writing NetEPIC and NetEA? The net-armageddon.org website doesn't try to explain it either. Nor does netepic.org, but that site doesn't look like it's very active.

If we create a sticky, which forum does it go in?
Author:  Blip [ Sat Jan 09, 2016 9:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
Yes, the NetEpic / NetEA thing is particularly unfortunate. It was particularly upsetting to tell a friend I'd introduced epic to that he'd gone off (used google rather than my link) downloaded and then spent the whole week of evenings reading the NetEpic Gold rules instead, which was why the army list I'd given him didn't make any sense!

The "Net" prefix is a good "joke" for those in know, but confusing as hell for anyone for any one this is all new to. Personally I would tag them all with "1,2,3,4th edition epic" somewhere, but it's a bit late for that I guess.
Author:  carlisimo109 [ Sat Jan 09, 2016 2:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
Here's how I would lay out the flowchart. It looks like all the E:A groups use the same rules rather than having their own, fortunately.

Attachments:
Epic Flowchart (carlisimo109).png
Epic Flowchart (carlisimo109).png [ 25.15 KiB | Viewed 7327 times ]
Author:  Kyrt [ Mon Jan 11, 2016 4:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Edition: Epic Armageddon vs Epic40k Questions
Not sure what "in common" means? Also "Heresy (unreleased)" is probably unnecessary and confusing for anyone who doesn't already know all this stuff.

I had a look at it turns out I had updated my diagram slightly. Have added the HH lists but not sure whether to add FERC.
Attachment:
Epic timeline 2016-01-11.png
Epic timeline 2016-01-11.png [ 196.15 KiB | Viewed 7291 times ]
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