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| Engaging a Formation on Overwatch http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=29355 |
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| Author: | Scutarii [ Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:53 am ] |
| Post subject: | Engaging a Formation on Overwatch |
Hi, Can anyone find rules references for what happens when Formation A on Overwatch is engaged by Formation B. Half of Formation A ends up in base to base contact, half is in firefight. All of Formation B is in base to base. Who gets to shoot? Everyone? Who can they target? Anyone? Does being in B2B prevent shooting? |
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| Author: | Ginger [ Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Engaging a Formation on Overwatch |
1.10 Overwatch, 2nd para says Quote: A formation that is on overwatch may choose to shoot immediately after an enemy formation completes a move or unloads troops, and before the target either shoots or assaults. There is nothing preventing units that are now in B-B from shooting, so all defending units that have LoS and range to an attacking unit may fire, even if that unit is now in B-B with a defender. So, basically everyone can shoot under the usual restrictions. One of the more typical restrictions is terrain which may limit or prohibit some units from firing. Rarely, some or all of the attackers my now be outside the arc of fire (if attacking some WE or titans that were on OW). Note RAW, shooting is done at the end of the engage move, preventing shooting at units that are now 'hidden' even if they could be seen at the start of their movement, although some people play a house rule that moving through an arc of fire makes a unit eligible for shooting. |
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| Author: | captPiett [ Wed Mar 25, 2015 2:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Engaging a Formation on Overwatch |
Also (and Dave can speak to this since it has popped up in a few of our games and this is how we played it), if the engaging FM units end their move in cover (including touching the engaged FM AVs or WEs) the overwatching FM needs to take the -1 to shoot at those units. For example, genestealers in base-to-base with a rhino get the benefit of being in cover for purposes of the overwatch fire. |
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| Author: | IJW Wartrader [ Wed Mar 25, 2015 2:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Engaging a Formation on Overwatch |
Also also, don't forget to check if the engaging formation gets broken by the overwatch fire as this will prevent the assault from happening... |
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| Author: | Scutarii [ Wed Mar 25, 2015 11:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Engaging a Formation on Overwatch |
And if two formations are intermingled on the receiving end, one of which is on Overwatch, only that formation gets to fire? Because I was fairly certain that if they get intermingled they are treated as one formation? So half the new 'intermingled formation' is on Overwatch'. What if the engaging formation is a coordinated (or aerial) assault do you have to choose one formation to fire at or is that one treated as one formation and thus fire could be assigned to either or both? Thanks guys! |
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| Author: | Ginger [ Thu Mar 26, 2015 12:46 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Engaging a Formation on Overwatch |
Intermingling only relates to the formation(s) that are the target of the assault. It has no effect on OW fire, which is a separate concept. Intermingling brings together a number of defending formations into a single "formation" for the duration of the assault. OW fire is used by the defending player to try to disrupt the opposing army in some way. After a formation moves or disembarks, any number of enemy formations on OW may use their OW to shoot at it within the usual constrains of range, LoS and arc. OW shooting is resolved in exactly the same way as normal shooting. Note, a formation that marches is effectively making three moves, and may be shot at the end of each move. Where one formation uses "Commander" to bring in other formations (or a WE declares an assault), they are all treated as a single formation for the purposes of shooting as well as for the assault. So, any hits that are caused by OW shooting are placed front to back across the "formation" like any other shooting, ignoring the fact that there are several different formations involved. Note, the single BM for being shot is place on the formation which includes the unit nearest the shooting formation. The other formation(s) do not get a BM for being shot. This process is repeated for each OW formation, so it is quite possible for the BMs for being shot at are applied to the same formation, or to be scattered; it all depends on the location of each firing formation relative to the target units. |
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| Author: | Geep [ Thu Mar 26, 2015 12:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Engaging a Formation on Overwatch |
Regarding an Aerial Assault, it would be my understanding that: since Overwatch fire happens in response to movement, and since landing does not count as movement (but the subsequent disembarking of the assaulting unit does), Overwatch fire would be applied to the disembarking unit only. Does that sound right? I may be confusing the rules for shooting at an Aerial Assault landing with shooting at a Planetfall landing. |
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| Author: | kadeton [ Thu Mar 26, 2015 3:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Engaging a Formation on Overwatch |
As in Ginger's post above, the assaulting formations (both the air transport and the formation disembarking from it) are treated as a single formation. So the overwatch hits would be applied front to back across the transport and the transported formation. |
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| Author: | Dave [ Thu Mar 26, 2015 4:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Engaging a Formation on Overwatch |
Disembark would trigger the OW, yes. But they'd be considered one formation at that point so your hits could be applied to the AC. Also, since it's a WE you could only target it. As to where yhe BM for coming under fire would go... I'd say the commander's formation or the formation disembarking. |
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| Author: | Ginger [ Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Engaging a Formation on Overwatch |
Dave, the question about placing the BM for coming under fire was answered by Neal Hunt a long time ago. Unfortunately I cannot find the relevant answer. Basically it has to be placed on the formation with the unit that is closest to the firers; any other choice is potentially invalid:- - Disembarking troops may be behind the air-transport relative to the firers, which prevents them being shot at - The commander's formation might not be a valid target for shooting either (outside LoS or range etc) There is a separate but related question here regarding BMs following the destruction of the transport due to OW fire. The answer is that the BMs remain on the 'combined formation' for the duration of the assault, but then the transport's BMs evaporate once the assault is completed and the formations become separate entities. This ought to be in the FAQ, but was apparently missed off. |
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