Tactical Command
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Flak question
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=22172		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  Reedar [ Sat Dec 31, 2011 12:00 am ]
Post subject:  Flak question
Quick Flak rules question.

In the below scenario, how many blast markers does the incoming air assault receive?

Air assault (THawk with marines for arguments sake) comes in to attack my ground formation which contains flak units and is also on overwatch.
Ground formation takes its 'free' flak shot (assume no damage done)
Ground formation then lets rip with its overwatch fire (again, assume no damage done)

I think it's only 1 blast marker, but I'm not 100% sure.

Cheers
Author:  dptdexys [ Sat Dec 31, 2011 9:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
it should be 2 BM's.
1 for the flak attacks and 1 for the overwatch shooting.
Author:  Reedar [ Sat Dec 31, 2011 9:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
Lovely, cheers for clarifying that DT
Author:  Ginger [ Sat Dec 31, 2011 9:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
And when firing the flak weapons (lets assume Hydras in an IG formation) they fire twice; once at an AA target using their AA factor, and once at a WE ground target using their AT factor. The two events are completely separate, hence two BM's as Dptdexys says.
Author:  Lord Aaron [ Sun Jan 01, 2012 2:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
just a follow up, would u fire over watch when the hawk landed or when the guys got out? or u have the option?
Author:  Onyx [ Sun Jan 01, 2012 8:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
You can only fire Overwatch if someone gets out of the Thunderhawk.
A Thunderhawk landing does not trigger Overwatch by itself.
Author:  Jaggedtoothgrin [ Sun Jan 01, 2012 9:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
how so? landing is completing a move, which is one of the triggers for overwatch
Author:  Onyx [ Sun Jan 01, 2012 12:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
Jaggedtoothgrin wrote:
how so? landing is completing a move, which is one of the triggers for overwatch

It's in the FAQ :)
Quote:
Q: When units appear on the table, for example by teleporting, or spawning, or being summoned, do they trigger Overwatch?
A: No. Only completing a move or disembarking triggers Overwatch.
Also, note that “a move” in the context of Overwatch has been ruled to be a normal ground move. An aerospace move (planetfall or a landing aircraft) does not trigger overwatch, nor does a countercharge move during an assault.
Author:  Jaggedtoothgrin [ Sun Jan 01, 2012 12:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
cool. well that should answer the question about air assault barges then.
if its not a ground move and thus, triggers overwatch, then its not able to barge becaue its not on the ground
Author:  Ginger [ Sun Jan 01, 2012 7:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
The point on OW can be split into two definitions:
  • If the formation is a "ground" formation, OW can be taken before or after disembarkation,
  • If it is and "air" formation, OW can only be taken after disembarcation.
And before you ask, the air transport only becomes a 'ground' formation at the end of its movement after disembarkation has occured.

As to barging, that applies to WE and makes no distinction as to whether the WE is airborne or not; AFAIK the concept of airborne barging has always been allowed.
Author:  Jaggedtoothgrin [ Sun Jan 01, 2012 10:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
the point on OW is in no way worded as to split into two sections, except for "after a move" and "after disembarkation"

and an aircraft, while airborne, ignores other models. which makes contacting them (needed for a barge) impossible until it is a ground vehicle.
if it doesnt become a ground vehicle until after it has finished moving, thus not triggering overwatch, then it cannot possibly have been a ground vehicle long enough to barge anything while landing
Author:  Onyx [ Mon Jan 02, 2012 1:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
It's in the FAQ :)
Quote:
Q: Can an aircraft land in an enemy ZoC?
A: Only if they are making an Air Assault. In such a situation the aircraft could land right in the middle of a formation, and, assuming it was a War Engine, it could barge enemy units out of the way in order to make space in which to land.
Author:  Jaggedtoothgrin [ Mon Jan 02, 2012 7:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
but the two are mutually exclusive, which means that the FAQ mus be wrong in one of those instances or the other
Author:  Onyx [ Mon Jan 02, 2012 11:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
The FAQ is right in both instances and it's been there for years now.
There isn't much else to add at this point ;)
Author:  Jaggedtoothgrin [ Mon Jan 02, 2012 12:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Flak question
when the FAQ says two contradictory things, it cannot possibly be right in both instances. it can be wrong in both instances, but not right.
so clearly there is something still to add (or more accurately, one or two FAQ responses that violate the written rules should be removed)
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