See now, Titans in 40k (ie Firefight range) isn't a too problematic thought. Especially assault or scout variants...

However a general letting anything near his ICBMs is a lunatic!!!

To be fair, considering the skill of some IG gunners, Deathstrikes are used in 40K because that's the only way the crew can hit the enemy.

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The Apocrypha of Skaros 1.1
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The Horus Heresy 0.5
Night Lords 0.1
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Games of 40k look like this now.

Eight hours of moving your models forwards, shooting, then putting them in the army case.

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

Look, just drive up beside the tank with the Deathstrike launcher carrying the missile, then release the catches on one side to let the ICBM roll off the side onto the tank, thereby causing a glancing hit. Obviously.

@ E & C: Someone's parents don't take enough interest in teaching their children the worth of money, unless you can get all that from Ebay. And he needs to spend more time away from the painting table to do other things. I've never finished painting a whole army in my life, unless all black undercoat counts as a paint scheme, too many other things to do. In saying that though, I will finish my epic Eldar before I leave China or bust. Indeed, hopefully finish this year (it is 2012, right?).

Questions though:

Is it not a bit too easy cutting 40K to bits? Yes
Is it enjoyable? Yes
Is this not why GW closed their forums? Yes
Will we keep doing it anyway? Yes
Will you send me all your money? Yes
PM me for my paypal.

On a less serious note, I've never played WFB, but I heard it was a far better 'game' than 40K, with the only thing being that 1 model probably actually represents a lot more than one man/whatever. Do they now suffer from Spell Creep?

WFB was a pretty good game about 5 years ago.

"Randomness creep" has killed it, though. Now it's more about rolling loads of dice and finding out what happens than tactical choices.

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Randomness is better than if the game was ruled by the players skill. So less sklilled players are much less frustrated about the game (and probably quitting it because of that) because they win sometimes.

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We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/

Better for the company, and better for kids, but not better for adults!

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

From our friend Curis over at Ninjabread...

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At one point WFB was a game of maneuver and command/control. A lot of people compared it to napoleonics in that regard. Around here it was generally regarded as a tactical step up from 40K. Of course the last time I played was about 5 years ago - 2 editions ago, possibly 3.

I've heard other people make comments similar to E&C's about the more recent rules versions. Certainly, the "randomness to keep everyone in the game" concept smacks of GW's marketing strategy.

Yup, WFB is currently on its 8th edition, which has been seriously dumbed down and randomised from 7th, which was probably its best edition. 7th edition started as a tactically interesting game of manouver, sacrifice and misdirection, but became plagued by a substancial codex creep, so by the end it was a game of uberheroes who could wipe out regiments on their own.

Now it's just like 40k, all about list design and equating "throwing as many dice as possible" with "fun". Bleh.

Must start checking out Kings of War a bit more!

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Problem is that 'throwing as many dice as possible' actually decreases the possibility that an unexpected outcome occurs.

The main function of the 'bucket of dice, one at a time' system is to delay the game enough that nothing significant happens beyond setting up your miniatures for display.

They counter balance that by adding low numbers of dice to be used for important game-changing moments, like every single time you charge your foot infantry could move between 6" and 16", for example.

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Wow. Seriously? That's dorked up.

I can understand possibly having a little bit of variation so the ability to dead-eye an 8" move doesn't overshadow tactical ability, but that's just nuts.

Yup, charging in WFB is now basic move speed + 2D6 inches.

So for infantry it's 4"+2d6", craziness.

And it's not alone. That level of randomness has made it into most aspects of the game system.

Heck, the magic phase has been turned into something even more random than the above, if you can believe it. 1st turn magical nuke bombs are not uncommon, but neither are full game magical fizzles uncommon.


WFB is very much a "game" now, not a "wargame".

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter