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How exactly does this work for Iyanden
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Author:  Dughan [ Tue Apr 06, 2010 9:53 pm ]
Post subject:  How exactly does this work for Iyanden
SPECIAL RULE – The Living Few
Iyanden suffers with a depleted population which has driven them, in times of
need, to raising Spirit Warriors to fight in their stead. As a result, Iyanden
Craftworld Eldar Armies may not have more individual Eldar Guardian Warhosts,
Aspect Warrior, Ranger, or Windrider Troupes than they have Spirit Warrior
Warhosts.

Ok, so does that mean that if you have only one guardian warhost and one spirit warrior warhost, you cannot include an aspect warrior troupe?
i may be kinda dense on this one, but i was curious how to handle this rule.
Author:  Spectrar Ghost [ Tue Apr 06, 2010 10:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
I don't know if you play WFB, but it works like the old rules for Skaven. You may not have more of any specific formation than you have Spirithosts. You may take 1 Eldar Guardian Warhost, 1 Aspect Warrior Troupe, 1 Ranger Troupe , and 1 Windrider Troupe for each Spirithost taken.
Author:  Flogus [ Tue Apr 06, 2010 11:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
Dughan wrote:
Ok, so does that mean that if you have only one guardian warhost and one spirit warrior warhost, you cannot include an aspect warrior troupe?

Right.
Only one 'living' formation per Spirit Warriors Warhost.

The "or" in "may not have more individual Eldar Guardian Warhosts,
Aspect Warrior, Ranger, or Windrider Troupes than they have Spirit Warrior
Warhosts" is an "or" exclusive, not an "or" inclusive.
Author:  Spectrar Ghost [ Tue Apr 06, 2010 11:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
Dughan wrote:
SPECIAL RULE – The Living Few
Iyanden suffers with a depleted population which has driven them, in times of
need, to raising Spirit Warriors to fight in their stead. As a result, Iyanden
Craftworld Eldar Armies may not have more individual Eldar Guardian Warhosts,
Aspect Warrior, Ranger, or Windrider Troupes than they have Spirit Warrior
Warhosts.

Italics added. The 'or' makes it clear that each of these are to be considered seperately. If they were to be considered together, it would be an 'and'.
Author:  Morgan Vening [ Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
Also, the use of the word 'individual' seems to reinforce it.

If it was only to be one 'living formation' per Spirit Host, removal of 'individual' from the list of applicable units, and adding 'in total' to the end would be a better way of writing it instead.

Example
SPECIAL RULE – The Living Few
Iyanden suffers with a depleted population which has driven them, in times of need, to raising Spirit Warriors to fight in their stead. As a result, Iyanden Craftworld Eldar Armies may not have more Eldar Guardian Warhosts, Aspect Warrior, Ranger, or Windrider Troupes in total than they have Spirit Warrior Warhosts.

But then,

SPECIAL RULE – The Living Few
Iyanden suffers with a depleted population which has driven them, in times of need, to raising Spirit Warriors to fight in their stead. As a result, Iyanden Craftworld Eldar Armies may not have more living formations (Eldar Guardian Warhosts, Aspect Warrior, Ranger, or Windrider Troupes) than they have Spirit Warrior Warhosts.

would maybe be a better way of wording it, if that's it's intent.

Not that I necessarily like the way the rule works. "Hey, guys. We're going to go fight the
Orks. I'll take Harley, Davidson, Honda, Triumph, Yamaha and Suzuki. Sorry Ducati, you can't come. Quota's full. But you 40 Guardians, 30 Aspects, and 40 Scouts can.". Reeks of affirmitive action. :) And how come I can take 8 stands of Rangers, but only if I don't seperate them into two groups?

But anyway, I digress. A lot.

Morgan Vening
Author:  Angel_of_Caliban [ Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
Dughan wrote:
SPECIAL RULE – The Living Few
Iyanden suffers with a depleted population which has driven them, in times of
need, to raising Spirit Warriors to fight in their stead. As a result, Iyanden
Craftworld Eldar Armies may not have more individual Eldar Guardian Warhosts,
Aspect Warrior, Ranger, or Windrider Troupes than they have Spirit Warrior
Warhosts.

Ok, so does that mean that if you have only one guardian warhost and one spirit warrior warhost, you cannot include an aspect warrior troupe?
i may be kinda dense on this one, but i was curious how to handle this rule.


I was under the impression that you must have equal to or more Spirit Hosts then all and any other "Living" formation in your list.

Example:
1 Guardian Warhost, 1 Aspect, 1 Windrider and 1 Ranger could only be played if you had four or more Spirit Hosts as well.
Author:  Spectrar Ghost [ Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
Not as far as I'm aware. I've always understood it to be that each 'living' formation gets as many choices as Spirithosts, similar to the Clanrat restriction in the old Skaven Army Book. Perhaps Chroma will appear in a poof of smoke and clarify the situation? I believe he wrote the rule, originally.
Author:  Chroma [ Wed Apr 07, 2010 1:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
Angel_of_Caliban wrote:
1 Guardian Warhost, 1 Aspect, 1 Windrider and 1 Ranger could only be played if you had four or more Spirit Hosts as well.


*POOF*

Ah, no, it's meant that for each Spirit Warhost you can have one each of Guardian Warhost, Aspect, Windrider and Ranger Troupe.

If you wanted *two* of any of the limited formations, you'd need two Spirit Warhosts first.

I "inherited" the rule from the previous Champion and think I could use some work; any thoughts on how it could be re-written/re-done?
Author:  Spectrar Ghost [ Wed Apr 07, 2010 2:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
Personally, I don't think it needs work.

If it were to be rewritten, I would suggest including Spirit Warrior Troupes in the "dead" category. Then it might be possible to make it a "more dead formations than living ones" style rule. However, at first glance, this change would:

1) Reduce activation count in what is already (in my experiance) a low count army.
2) Possibly (I'd have to make up some lists) make the only viable strategy a Wraithgate based one.

Thoughts?
Author:  Angel_of_Caliban [ Wed Apr 07, 2010 2:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
Chroma wrote:
Angel_of_Caliban wrote:
1 Guardian Warhost, 1 Aspect, 1 Windrider and 1 Ranger could only be played if you had four or more Spirit Hosts as well.


*POOF*

Ah, no, it's meant that for each Spirit Warhost you can have one each of Guardian Warhost, Aspect, Windrider and Ranger Troupe.

If you wanted *two* of any of the limited formations, you'd need two Spirit Warhosts first.

I "inherited" the rule from the previous Champion and think I could use some work; any thoughts on how it could be re-written/re-done?

*Cough Cough*

*Waves 'Poof of Smoke' away*

Well I guess I misunderstood. Your view seem more playable anyways. I'll have to give it some thought about a better wording or even rule.
Author:  Spectrar Ghost [ Wed Apr 07, 2010 2:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
Spectrar Ghost wrote:
However, at first glance, this change would:

1) Reduce activation count in what is already (in my experiance) a low count army.
2) Possibly (I'd have to make up some lists) make the only viable strategy a Wraithgate based one.


It would also allow armies with NO Wraithguard, only Spirit Warrior Troupes, so perhaps not.

I would say the rule does not need to be changed, though a rewording might help. Not sure how that rewording might go. though.
Author:  Angel_of_Caliban [ Wed Apr 07, 2010 2:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
What's the feeling about moving Guardians to the Troupe section? Then the rule would be void as you would have to run Spirit Hosts.

Crazy Idea? Maybe....
Author:  Spectrar Ghost [ Wed Apr 07, 2010 2:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
Well, the problem is activation count. Guardian Warhosts are needed as cheap activations to get more support formations and boost activation count. Move them to the troupe section, and they will be a part of the problem. If I need to spend 350pt to get any support, it will be hard to get 3 activations per thousand, especially if I take Wave Serpents or Wraithlords, or even Wraithseers to go with.
Author:  Angel_of_Caliban [ Wed Apr 07, 2010 2:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
Spectrar Ghost wrote:
Well, the problem is activation count. Guardian Warhosts are needed as cheap activations to get more support formations and boost activation count. Move them to the troupe section, and they will be a part of the problem. If I need to spend 350pt to get any support, it will be hard to get 3 activations per thousand, especially if I take Wave Serpents or Wraithlords, or even Wraithseers to go with.

May be a typo but the Guardian Host is 300 points in the Iyanden List. So I don't think 50 pts is going to make a difference if isn't a typo.

*Rubs Chroma's Lap*
Author:  Spectrar Ghost [ Wed Apr 07, 2010 2:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: How exactly does this work for Iyanden
It's a typo. 150pt just like everyone else.
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