[BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points |
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Chroma
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points  Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 3:24 pm |
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Had a lot of games this past weekend, and one involved Biel-Tan. ?Used the "1 Spirit Stone per 1000 points" rule and it really didn't make that big a difference in the game. ?The Autarch has leader by being supreme commander, so that formation doesn't need it, if you've got an even number of BMs, you still can't clear them all, so you only tend to need it for formations with odd numbers of blast markers, which are, usually, slightly more than half of the units you've got with blast markers.
Here's the Battle
Please feel free to comment!
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Moscovian
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:18 pm |
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Concise, easy to read Batrep. Thanks! Not sure if it clarified anything on the Spirit Stone issue other than the 1000-1 rules didn't help limit it.
ePilgrim suggested just making a rule change that the extra BM be removed before the removal of BMs during the rally.
It keeps formations with 3 BMs from going down to zero, which I am sure irritates a lot of players.
In relation to your game, this would have had affected Aspect formation 2 on turn two by giving them 1 BM to contend with as opposed to zero. They still would have broken that turn, but may not have had an opportunity to rally (never know).
Can you think of anyplace else where this would have made a difference? Seems like the Tau focused heavily on your Aspect 1 formation. 
_________________ author of Syncing Forward and other stories...It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.
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Chroma
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:24 pm |
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| Quote (Moscovian @ 05 April 2006 (16:18)) | | Can you think of anyplace else where this would have made a difference? ?Seems like the Tau focused heavily on your Aspect 1 formation. ? |
It was the BTS goal and a "mixed" formation so units with both AP and AT weapons could hit it.
I'm starting to feel that Spirit Stones might not be the problem people are making it out to be, heck, if it had a different name, like "Embolden" or something, I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be an issue... especially with pop-ups and such being toned down.
A few point tweaks might be all the Eldar need to "balance" them now.
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semajnollissor
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:38 pm |
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Hmm, it seems to me that the spiritstone rule doesn't get used all that much (when not using large numbers of tanks). It makes me think that maybe a few points adjustments would do the trick.
What if Aspect warhosts were bumped up to 325 or 350? how badly would that ruin someone's day? Also, windriders to 225 or 250?
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Chroma
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:44 pm |
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| Quote (semajnollissor @ 05 April 2006 (16:38)) | | What if Aspect warhosts were bumped up to 325 or 350? how badly would that ruin someone's day? Also, windriders to 225 or 250? |
Well, I'm a big proponent of the "10% increase" for base formations, so I wouldn't have any problem with it at all. I'd recommend they be rounded to the nearest 25 point level for most things, and a few, like Rangers, might not need an adjustment.
Honestly, I think it's a simple solution for the problem and that it works.
In my play group, trying the "10% rule" really seemed to bring Eldar back in line with the original three armies.
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Moscovian
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:53 pm |
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I don't want to kidnap the batrep here, but since you guys brought it up....
I agree, Chroma. The Spirit Stones are not the issue. The issue (I brought it up on MC23's thread) is the win ratio. If the Eldar just plain sucked and had Spirit Stones there would be no issue.
The point tweaks mentioned by Neal on the Titans seems completely reasonable. Change from 650-750-850 to 700-750-800 (these Warlocks are beautiful but not worth 850). This would make it more difficult to field the Revenants which many have a problem with (kill two eldar birds with one spirit stone  ).
Another point tweak I heard was swaping points on the Wraithguard and Wraithlord, making the more popular Wraithguard 175. Again, I understand the logic and could see it.
Bumping Aspects would be rough for a couple of reasons. The only way to get a SupCmdr for the Eldar is with the Autarch, which means you are realistically spending 400 for the formation. Add transports and it is a 600 point formation.
Aspects are VERY expensive given that only two of them have ranged weapons (Dark Reapers at 45cm and Fire Dragons at a whopping 15cm).
And wind riders getting a point bump? I barely take them as they are. They really have limited capabilities other than being able to claim objectives and occasionally wipe out the stragglers that float around in a game.
Neal said it very well: the Eldar need a nudge. The experimental rules will really help (especially skimmer rules) and maybe the above suggestions to keep the masses appeased.:cool:
Did you guys see the Battlestats on Eldar lately? Eldar dropped below 60% as part of their steady decline for the year.
_________________ author of Syncing Forward and other stories...It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.
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Moscovian
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:55 pm |
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| Quote (Chroma @ 05 April 2006 (16:24)) | | It was the BTS goal and a "mixed" formation so units with both AP and AT weapons could hit it. |
Was just curious. They got beat up pretty bad, that's all.  _________________ author of Syncing Forward and other stories...It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.
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Chroma
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:59 pm |
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| Quote (Moscovian @ 05 April 2006 (16:53)) | | Did you guys see the Battlestats on Eldar lately? ?Eldar dropped below 60% as part of their steady decline for the year. |
Yep, I noticed that drop when I was posting results after the weekend... it's a *good* thing to me.
Okay, maybe not all formations need a point increase, all our testing with the "10% Rule" was using Ulthwe anyway. The skimmer changes, a few point tweaks: Wraithguard and Titans, and I think it's "problem solved" for the Eldar.
The Spirit Stones being a problem because they are "unfluffly" is completely irrelevant to balancing the army list, it was just a "cute" way of referring to a blast marker management technique for the Eldar and I think people should stop trying to figure out some "explanation" for it in the game world.
And I've got to disagree with you on Jetbikes Moscovian, they rock! It's 200 points for flying Space Marines: Armour 4+, FF 4+, 35cm movement! They are great in support and for attacking CC units, especially coming out of a 'Gate!
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Moscovian
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:21 pm |
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You might be right on the jetbikes. It could be they just don't fit my style of play.
And I agree wholeheartedly with you on the Eldar. Now, the problem is not the Spirit Stones but convincing a bunch of people that the HOURS they discussed trying to revamp the Spirit Stones was unnecessary (that's sure to flame this thread:oops:).
Hopefully people will see that maybe they were just jumping the gun. It happens.
_________________ author of Syncing Forward and other stories...It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.
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Chroma
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:22 pm |
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| Quote (Moscovian @ 05 April 2006 (16:55)) | | Was just curious. ?They got beat up pretty bad, that's all. ? |
In all probablity, his attack with the third Stealth Contingent *should* have wiped them out and scored him BTS, what with all the firststrike attacks, but the dice were not in his favour... ?
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Chroma
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:24 pm |
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| Quote (Moscovian @ 05 April 2006 (17:21)) | | Hopefully people will see that maybe they were just jumping the gun. ? It happens. |
Actually, I'd just like to know where the heck Sotec/Tepoc is!
I emailed him a while back, but never got a response. I played against him at the Oakville GW EPIC Game Day in February, and we had some good dicussions, but I haven't heard from him since!
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Moscovian
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:33 pm |
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Chroma
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:53 pm |
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| Quote (Moscovian @ 05 April 2006 (17:33)) | | Only know him through email and posts but he seems like good people. ?I hope he's alright. |
Well, he was a tonne of fun playing against! ?(My OGBM vs his Biel-Tan) ?
It was two experienced, veteran gamers playing 3000 points, in four turns (he actually won, barely, in Turn 3, but we kept on playing!) done in half the time of anyone else at the Game Day! ?*laugh*
So we sat and chewed the fat afterward. ?*laugh* ?I hope he's okay too!
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thurse
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:56 pm |
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Nice report!
I would have put the autarch in the other unit as its re-roll is wasted when in reserve, but I'm perhaps missing something
And btw since the idea of making the SS ability linked to some killable units was not very popular, I therefore agree with you guys. Let's create a club... ( And debate on what should be reevaluated )
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tneva82
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Post subject: [BatRep] Biel-Tan vs Tau - 2000 points Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 6:02 pm |
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| Quote (Chroma @ 05 April 2006 (16:59)) | | And I've got to disagree with you on Jetbikes Moscovian, they rock! It's 200 points for flying Space Marines: Armour 4+, FF 4+, 35cm movement! They are great in support and for attacking CC units, especially coming out of a 'Gate! |
Especially if you use them aggressively with hit&run.
Couple of formations of these and suitably BM'ed targets around and they will run havoc among enemy army. What's NOT to like uber fast FF4+ Armour 4+.
I wouldn't go so far as say they are broken but they are darn usefull and certainly unit we pay attention to._________________ www.tneva.net
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