RugII wrote:
For the record I'm not for changes to to the ratio of core to support formations and I've never had a problem with Void Spinners. I think there are other lists which are more problematic than Eldar.
I'm surprised that changes are already being discussed when we know where there is a problem with the BT list, the rules are played differently to the rest of the world. That's not a problem but it is the elephant in the room.
I do think though that in at least this instance the LoS difference is going to have a reduced impact. If my understanding is correct part of the issue is reliable turn 1 stripping of activations, exacerbating the already large number of activations BT can get.
Changing points or ratios to reduce a 12-13 list to an 11-12 list has limited impact on this issue if the non-BT list loses 3 activations turn 1 before they get to act anyway.
This early stripping comes from long range high power shooting - Scorpions and Void Spinners - hitting small support formations. Not every list is affected by this - Squats for example tend towards chunky formations - while for other lists this is a big issue - Steel Legion being the poster child with so many 3 unit formations.
The reason I don't think LoS differences are likely to have as much of an impact on this issue is that on turn 1 it's usually not
that difficult to find somewhere to put a 3 unit formation out of sight, or a scout formation garrisoned forward somewhere you can only hit one or two units.
From Tiny-Tim here :
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=32195&start=15Quote:
Turn 1 started as most would expect, Strategy to Eldar, Void Spinners shoot. First shot was at the Deathstrikes, 1 hit 1 dead, broken. Second shot was at the Basilicks, 1 hit 1 dead, broken. Third activation a Scorpion doubled, moved, shot, moved back. Whilst moving the first time I goaded E&C into using one of his overwatch shots which caused a wound and 2 BMs. Scorpion shot at the Hydra formation and destroyed 2 tanks breaking the formation. So three activations and three broken IG formations plus one Guard activation burnt. E&C played a refused flank and pushed forward on his right flank whilst I was cautious activating my right flank and got left behind. I pushed forward both of the Shining Spears at the end of the turn looking to set up a sweeping set of engagements in turn two to clear the centre of the table and box E&C in on his right flank. By the end of the turn the Deathstrikes, Basilicks, Sentinels, Hydras and Roughriders were all broken. Some rallied, but the Deathstrikes would fail all three turns.
Can the Aussies chime in on wether or not I am understanding the problem they are facing properly or have I extrapolated from one data point waaaaay too much?
Are you finding any particular factions having more or less of an issue with the BT?