The Tau are undoubtedly one of the 'best' races for Epic, for me they are up there with the Imperial Guard. The whole kit, skimmer tanks, guided missiles, airpower, just screams all those future sci-fi games I've played.

Sadly in Epic they have been to date somewhat easy to overpower and occasionally frustrating to playtest (arg, A-10's!). I think this is in part because of the 'extra's that have been added. Take GM's. An excellent idea and one that I think should be present in every Tau list. However adding AP GM's killed the slight croak left in infantry. For an 'armour' list the additions are great, indeed that is what it effectively is now. Sadly they also make the list fairly static baring looking over intervening terrain or suicide runs in to set markerlights on the enemy.

The list does need some weaknesses. For me this is bad assault power, having to have infantry (so there is something for the enemy to assault, all skimmer hordes are upsetting), a lack of 'proper' long range fire (horizon range shots) and 'only' medium armour.

For me the advantages should be great manoeuvrability (skimmer/support craft/speed), short range firepower (unmatched), GM's, drones (lots of them to take the casualties and mitigate against assaults and enemy firepower) and versatile airpower (for deep striking purposes). These are both to negate the weaknesses if used properly and to give a 'style' to the army that screams Tau.

Overall the list should be both aggressive but not a headlong cavalry charge army.

Note I don't think being able to field a load of small formations for activation advantage is one bonus they should have, it totally unbalances co-ord fire for one. And yes they should match FW pack sizes.

I see Tau firepower - compared to the Imperial Guard - as the following. Note co-ord fire is a force multiplier to all of the following.
Above 90cm - Nonexistent. Gets round this with planetfalls, manoeuvrability (note this is Tau shorthand for speed <25cm and skimmer) and airpower (especially airpower).
90cm - Weaker than comparable forces, compensates using the strategies above (esp. Manta)
60-75cm - Comparable to Guard, but with a manoeuvrability advantage making up for weaker armour.
45cm - Tau firepower starts to fall off, generally avoiding this range band. either staying to railgun/gm range or using the speed to close to 30cm and below.
30cm - Better than anyone other than a specialised force (i.e. mechanised guard or similar, armies that have the majority of their shooting at this range, don't worry, still in that case probably have better long range fire). Achieved with markerlights, rate of fire, abilities like ignore cover and formation size.
15cm - Unmatched. Achieved by the above and high to hit values, manoeuvrability, disrupt, lots of drones and formation size/firepower. Idea is you can be delivered into the teeth of the enemy and survive, or prep for an assault and try to repel it.

Now a Tau armour list changes this. The majority of firepower is at the 60-75cm bad with heavy 90cm support from support craft. Due to skimmer and markerlights it is fairly static but does approximate a static Tau gun line firing as the enemies try to close. Note in this AP GM's and SMS effectively replace infantry.

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I see Tau as annoying fishheads that are essentially flying IG...

You likely want a real response though  

So here's one.

The Tau are an awesome list in potentia rather than in fact. They should have great firepower and be capable of using stand off tactics to harry their opponents, but it should not be their favorite tactic.

They should never, ever win a stand up shooting match with the Guard. No one should. Ever. The IG have heavy armor and heavy guns, but they're slow and ponderous and their infantry are speedbumps more than troops.

The Tau are fast, they fly, they have great guns. They are slower than the Eldar, so should have some more armor. They can't assault at all so awesome short range firepower is appropriate.

Thematically they should fit between the IG and the Eldar on the scale of speed vs armor with all three possessing enormous firepower.

So I have to agree with almost all of what TRC says.

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Fear is for the enemy, fear and bullets.
-James O'Barr, the Crow

So before we dive into units its time to correct the Tau stats. The Tau should not be extreme at every range band, indeed the lower the values the easier to balance especially with all the odd special rules that act as multipliers. Thw adjustments also try to move the Tau away from a long range pop up gun list to one requiring movement and tactics. In general firepower is moved in line with the above.

The Railcannon is a prime example. Its really really good. Far better than in the fluff actually. It is not twice as good as killing a tank as a lascannon if both are in range. That’s AT4+ at most. Likewise it does not have the AP of a battle cannon or similar weapons. So AP5+. This weapon cascades into a number of units, making stuff like broadsides harder to balance.
75cm AP5+/AT4+

Then its ‘twin’ the Ion cannon. Here the idea is to attempt to balance it with the Railcannon. It has a higher rate of fire but multiple shots in Epic favour sustaining not doubling, so here they can be amalgamated into one stat line as the Tau army is about mobility. The high rate of fire pushes up its overall performance to something similar to the railcannon, so 60cm AP4+/AT4+. A clear choice between range and AP firepower (of course the rail still wins, but this can then be fixed by looking at the forgeworld models.
60cm AP4+/AT4+

Missile pods. They are the short ranged equivalent of missile launchers according to those 40k players in the know. 30cm AP5+/AT6+ is fine and fits with the above, as well as opening possibilities for Air units (though I feel they should have seekers instead for reasons I shall outline later).

Then a few other stats change, mostly upgunning at short ranges or rationalising single/twin weapons and giving an effect to integral gun drones as you will see through the text.

Special rules need a severe trim. Some of this is slight of hand, other bits simply amalgamation.

Coordinated fire and Markerlights and Guided Missiles remain the same. Instead any potential abuses are solved with the army list structure with the ‘Firewarrior’ list using formation size and no AP GM’s while the ‘armour’ list exploits both to the full on purpose.

Supreme commander becomes a note in the unit stats.

Drones simply get the proposed 'expendable' rule of when they die they do not give a blast marker to the target formation. The garrison note becomes an armylist rule, not racial one.

Tau Jet Packs become ‘Tau Jet Packs follow all the rules for Jump Packs. Additionally if all units in a formation are equipped with Tau Jet Packs the formation may perform Hit and Run manoeuvres as described in elder special rule x.

Deflector Shields are very odd. Working in the exact opposite way to battlefleet gothic where they are ineffective against lance/TK fire and excellent against regular battery fire, in Epic they stuff any army that can’t command large amounts of AT fire to bring it down in the most cost effective way possible. Armies like Orks who rely on TK fire are pretty stuffed as big stuff like the Manta absorbs more than anything else in the game bar possibly Necrons. A simply way to show how they work and make them a bit different is to make them a flat 5+ invulnerable save. Far less words to.

Support Craft whatever the outcomes of discussion on this rule I hope it all makes sense, I still the image of flying saucers overhead!

Markerlight turret special rules are simply dropped. I'm sorry all the computer stuff cuts no ice. In epic formation suppression and breaking is a core part of the game. If you wish to avoid this use them as terrain features.

Unit split
Essentially what forgeworld makes, can be easily made or stuff like humans from SG, is the infantry list (note no AP gm’s in, that’s the firewarriors job). What everyone has devised goes into an armour list (could be entirely firewarrior free), both use core choices and formation sizes to dictate style.

Unit stats
Some changes here. For me the ‘gold standard’ is the firewarrior. Stats should make sense relative to him.

The Shas’s get a changed weapon. I can live with e range boost but plasma weapons are not AP4+’s, they are AP/AT. Going with the Tau philosophy above they get Disrupt to make them a more attractive choice, and to represent their higher than normal attendant drones providing twin pulse carbine fire.
30cm AP5+/AT6+ Disrupt

Pathfinders pulse carbines are twinned like drones so become AP6+ Disrupt. Really these guys should be scouts, or fire co-ordinators, not as I used to use them as replacement firewarriors.

Drones get the special rule changes and their weapons are not listed as being ‘twin’ with no stats changes. The biggest change for them is their army list availability.

Crisis. They carry far too many weapons for the numbers on the base compared to other units especially considering their saves are upped with shield drones, but that is their short range upgunning. The combination plasma and Fusion gets disrupt to assist with anti armour work (RA stuff may indeed survive) and to represent drones hanging around.
Twin-linked Missile Pods30cm AP4+/AT5+
Plasma Rifles and Fusion Blasters 15cm MW4+ Disrupt

Broadsides get the railgun change, ending up with a hopefully better to balance
Twin-linked solid shot Railguns 75cm AT3+

Tetras can twin linked pulse guns, upping their to hit to 4+ and making them better in and out markerlighting unit (go in, zap a screen, lite the target than peg it next turn).
Twin Linked Pulse Rifles, 30cm, AP4+

Piranha get Disrupt to show the drones blasting away.
Burst Cannon & Gun Drones 15cm AP4+ Disrupt
(still have gm's of course!)

Hammerhead. Lots of changes. First the speed falls to 25cm. This stops them having a large counter charge and is part of the assault poorness of Tau. Weapons change to match the model and the changed stats. It ends up with
2 x Burst Cannon, 15cm, AP4+
Seeker Missiles, 75cm, AT6+, Guided Missiles
Railgun, 75cm, AP5+/AT4+
This is I realise somewhat weaker than the current ‘head and this is reflected in the army list cost and formation size.

Ion head. Has the changed Ion cannon but also to match the model the SMS system, making the tank the equal finally of the rail head. I also include the other variants here, in an attempt to get them all into the game!
Smart Missile System 30cm AP5+ Ignore Cover
Seeker Missiles 75cm AT6+ Guided Missiles
One of the following:-
Ion Cannon 60cm AP4+/AT4+
Twin-linked Plasma Cannon 45cm AP4+/AT4+ Disrupt
2 x Missile Pods 30cm AP5+/AT6+
Twin-linked Fusion Cannon 15cm MW3+ Disrupt
Twin-linked Long Barreled Burst Cannon 30cm AP3+/AA5+

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TRC seems on the right lines to me... I like what he's done with the variant guns on the Hammerheads to make each one an attractive choice in its own right too, rather than having models that are sold relegated to the 'collector's' section.

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I agree E&C.  I like the concept that TRC has, which can be combined with Dobbsy' ideas (such as replacing the scorpionfish with the fussion hammer head).

The burst cannon hammer head could be an upgrade to formations to add some AP firepower (though I am not sure about the AA value).

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Tyranid air marshal

I like the concept that TRC has, which can be combined with Dobbsy' ideas (such as replacing the scorpionfish with the fussion hammer head).

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Honda

"Remember Taros? We do"

- 23rd Elysian Drop Regiment

Hugely against this idea and I'll leave it at that.

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I ama gainst the scorpionfish since I have always thought that there were referances to how the Tau are against super heavy tanks, since they are large bullet magnets.  I can't back this up, but I am sure that their is some referance to this.  Which is why they haven't built their own Titans, rather they just drop spaceships on them.  

Thus in my own little world the fusion head fits them better than a SHT.  A small quick group armed with MW that rush up and melt the SHTs.

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Tyranid air marshal

One quibble:

Missile Pods in 40k are identical to Autocannons with a shorter range, not Missile Launchers. Since they have the same Epic stats it doesn't matter, but hey if you make a mistake for a good reason you open yourself to making them for bad ones.

On Railguns vs Lascannons in 40k the Railgun penetrates armor thrice as often as a lascannon does against AV14.

Las is S9 +1d6 Glances armor 10 on 1, Pen armor 14 on 6
Rail is S10 +1d6 + 1 (for AP1) glances armor 12 on 1 Pen armor 14 on 4.

The Railcannon is superior to the Battlecannon against armor, but inferior against Infantry which should give it 75cm AP5+/AT3+ to keep it in line.

The Ioncannon is really inferior in every way unless you're shooting Marines with it. Might be worthwhile to go back to giving it AA6 to make it even with the Rail.

I like where the rest is going, though if Firewarriors get AT weapons then everyone should since all Tau guns are plasmaguns, Burst Cannons are Multilasers with better armor penetration in 40k, same Strength, same RoF.

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Fear is for the enemy, fear and bullets.
-James O'Barr, the Crow

Piranha still have the GM, just stuck down the change to the unit.



Skorps actually do have precedent as a cryptic cue in the Orca description in the forgeworld book, talking about a version with missiles/bombs and stuff.


Fairy snuff, my 40k knowledge comes entirely second hand.

Railcannons having 4+ does cascade nicely to the other railcannon totting units and makes stuff like broadsides easier to balance with firepower, lv and points.

It also means you can have a gun balanced with the ion cannon which I thought was a nice idea. The ion being weaker but having a higher rate of fire (effectively 'twin' here). The AA idea was done, but sadly was a non starter as AA trumps most other stuff, especially with a half way decent main attack. People used to make all ion formations and use them to shut down enemy airpower (2-3 formations of 6 AA6+ shots at 60cm range was a big deterant, especially with attached skyray, completely shut down some armies and was thought to infringe on the Eldar air/aa superiority). The ion itself of course has to have stats that allow it to be used easily on aircraft.

Unless they shouldn't be balanced and the ion should be a second rate choice? Certainly its not very pretty.

Firewarriors are unchanged, they have to rely on GM's for anti armour stuff. They really are a very good infantry unit and I think it makes sense background wise to build stuff relative to them. The Tau list has a direct fire AP emphasis with GMs for AT to try and pick up on their 'combined' and inter dependant nature. I don't think the idea is to build formations that act independantly but rather an army that boosts and operates with each other.

The idea though to bursts 15cm AP5+/AT6+ is interesting, just trying to figure out how much that would change units. On one hand its a lot more AT firepower at point blank, on the other it halves your AP hits when you double into range. It would probably most affect stealths and aircraft.

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General Plumer, 191x

The Skyray remains a beast though like the rail and ion has the speed dropped to 25. Not good news for mech formations but its still as steal at 75 points. Indeed its difficult to price as its not worth a 100. To get round this I consider them a near compulsory upgrade and mentally consider each mech/armour formation as having bought one, absorbing some of their ability into those formations cost.

The Devilfish gets a coupler of changes, one for scenario play and the other a straight up gunning for firewarrior formations risking all at 15cm.
Burst Cannon & Gun Drones, 15cm AP4+, Disrupt
Transport (may carry two infantry units not wearing battlesuits)

All Kroot get Walker. They are apparently excellent woodsmen and this is I think the best way to show it. Imagine them infiltrating in holding their breath under the swamp water

Also kroot hounds just don’t seem to cut it, so get 2 5+ attacks instead of one 4+.

Human auxiliaries are unchanged but come in proper sized garrison formations and costed as if that is the only thing they will be used for.

Now turrets. I know they aren’t a contentious part of the list! The no bp, break etc arguments don’t wash with me. It’s the core mechanic in Epic. Whether you are a slavering genestealer, blood crazed demon, machine spirit operated Land Raider or Necron god, you get blast markers and can break. Think of it as being a network crash or processor overload as info from the battlefield becomes to much to handle. List wise I have them being able to be carried by Orca, Manta and Tigersharks to improve there flexibility and the weapon turrets are back. If they are to fragile (and remember they are now also an activation) they could become fearless, but this would probably require a relative or hard cap.

Drone turret
Light Vehicle, 0cm, 4+, CC-, FF6+
Twin-linked Missile Pods, 30cm, AP4+/AT5+
Scout, Thick Rear Armour, Expendable. May deploy up to 15cm from a transport

Drone close defence turret
Light Vehicle, 0cm, 4+, CC-, FF5+
Twin-linked Plasma Rifles, 15cm, AP4+/AT4+
Twin-linked Fusion Blaster, 15cm, MW4+
Twin-linked Burst Cannon, 15cm, AP3+, Disrupt
Scout, Thick Rear Armour, Expendable. May deploy up to 15cm from a transport

Drone remote sensor turret (these are mixed with the others for defence)
Armored vehicle (it doesn’t have to open up), 6+, 0cm, 4+, CC-, FF-
Scout, Thick Rear Armour, Expendable, Markerlight

Aircraft

Well, lots of changes here. Tau aircraft tend to follow 40k rather than the watered down version of aircraft Epic gets for lots of boring in game balance reasons and an artificial ground focus (modern battles are very dull from a wargamers point of view ). Tau are definitely sub imperial. They are slower than Imperial interceptors and lack the experience and equivalent trainins. Instead they have excellent 3d awareness (probably more useful in space). In BFG they are inferior to all the other races fighters. I’m no airpower expert but I do know that slower planes generally lose dogfights as initial speed can be all important as you try to out manoeuvre your opponent (I’m sure Biggles can tell you in detail what makes for a good fighter) and of course is nearly everything when you are attempting intercepts.

The Barracuda does have the better 3d awareness and close in maneuver, but that can’t help you dodge bullets so ground attack maneuverability drops to fighter bomber. The 40k weapon load out – ion, 2 burst cannon, missile and seekers is simply too much to be a cheap plane and far better than other races. I don’t like dropping the ion AA attack as it is in all accounts the main interceptor weapon. So two versions present themselves. There is an alternative of dropping the seekers for the missile battery however I love the ground troops guiding in the smart munitions and would fight tooth and nail to keep it in, of course reinforces the whole Tau way of war as well. Instead the seekers and missiles are merged into a ‘seeker missiles battery’.

Version 1
Aircraft Fighter-bomber 6+ n/a n/a
Seeker Missile Battery, 45cm, AT6+, Guided Missiles
Ion Cannon, 30cm, AP4+/AT4+/AA6+, Fixed Forward Arc
2 x Burst Cannon, 15cm, AP4+/AA6+

This is the ‘expensive’ version, definitely 175 for two. Excellent defensive fire and ground attack firepower and only slightly worse in an intercept than a thunderbolt.

Version 2
Aircraft Fighter-bomber 6+ n/a n/a
Seeker Missile Battery, 45cm, AT6+, Guided Missiles
Ion Cannon, 30cm, AP4+/AT4+/AA5+, Fixed Forward Arc
Burst Cannons, 15cm, AP4+/AA6+

A better 30cm intercept but weaker overall in raw AA fire. It retains the 360 defence which I think shows the drone weapons and Tau 3d awareness excellently and gives them a racial ‘edge’ over other lists bar the orks. The drop in ground firepower hopefully allows the price to become 75 each with 2-3 in a squadron, allowing older collections with odd Barracuda to be used. They might however be slightly to powerful still for 75 points, but not by much (a matter of the odd %) and I think imperceptibly in the game. Of course if I'm wrong and it is to good it could become 5+ on the burst and 6+ on the ion, but that puts it frimly as a ground attack fighter so not an ideal solution.

Tigershark, oh Tigershark. Perhaps the only aircraft in Epic to be tougher than the 40k equivalent. Given its speed advantage over the Marauder (but its weaker armour) being lumbered with 4+ armour and no extra DC is fine. In fact every race with bombers in Epic has a 4+. They become bombers leaving the skies clear for Barracuda to give fighter cover. If they need a boost they could get the fighter bomber ability back, trouble is they have awesome AA stats and would need to be considered and priced as fighters. There AT firepower is upped, again to support firewarriors and to reflect their larger component of GM’s. They come only in squadrons of two which allows the carrying of drone squadrons (they simply don’t have the room apparently for 4 stands, barely able to carry 2 and a bit).
Aircraft Bomber 4+ n/a n/a
2 x Seeker Missile Batteries45cm AT6+ Guided Missiles
Twin-linked Ion Cannons, 30cm, AP3+/AT3+/AA4+, Fixed Forward Arc
Burst Cannons15cm AP4+/AA6+
Transport (may carry three of the following units: Gun Drones, Heavy Drones, Turrets); the Tiger Shark cannot land (and hence not air assault or embark troops) but can disembark Drones in the normal way after its approach move is completed.

The AX-10 gets a similar make over and at last can have a bit of sanity when it comes to try and price its excellent ground attack. And the gun stats relate better to the normal raicannon now as well. Comes in pairs only.
Aircraft Bomber 4+ n/a n/a
2 x Seeker Missile Batteries, 45cm, AT6+, Guided Missiles
Twin-linked Heavy Railcannon 30cm MW3+, Titan Killer (D3), Fixed Forward Arc
Burst Cannons, 15cm, AP4+/AA6+

A new addition! The Tiger Shark AX-2-2 and Remora Drone Stealth Fighters is in as it exists and makes a nice diorama (apparently though I’m still waiting to be show this mythical diorama). It needs a role and finds it as a cheap fighter for those that don’t want to splash out on barracuda or prefer flying war engines. Plus the stats are somewhat unique and deserve to be out there!
War Engine, Aircraft Fighter 6+ n/a n/a
3 x Seeker Missile Batteries, 45cm, AT6+, Guided Missiles
3 x Twin-linked Burst Cannons, 15cm, AP3+/AA5+
Damage Capacity 2. Critical Hit Effect: The Drone Control Relay is destroyed and the AX-2-2 aborts leaving the game. The aircraft counts as destroyed for victory point purposes

The Orca gets some changes. Well it gets less firepower and a better transport capacity following its fluff abilities and opening it up game wise. List wise there is a certain firewarrior restriction and it seems to on paper limit them well enough. The burst cannon gets a boost as well making it slightly harder to intercept.
Twin-linked Burst Cannon, 15cm, AP3+/AA5+
Transport (may carry up to 6 turrets OR ten infantry units with battlesuits taking two spaces each and an additional two units of drones)

Manta! Two different configs, mostly relating to transport capacities. This is the infantry list version. In brief the Manta goes to reaver size. This makes it a) easier to field in a game b) makes the self planetfall less of a devestaing tactic (really was grim) and c) reinforces that the Tau are not a ‘heavy’ force like the Imerpium. Note in the fluff Warlord are defeated by multiple Manta. The DC is higher but save lower as befitting a massive starship (well massive compared to infanty). Also int eh fluff it’s a super heavy assault transport so the capacity is upped massively. Wether this allows overwaelming assaults to be done cheaply is something I would need feedback on. Going to reaver size also allows the 40k weapons load out to be used. The Burst cannons though are an abstraction as it seems to be covered by them at every angle by 4, that’s how many they are abstracted to. As a spaceship it gets AA defence as well. The long range represents the longer distance to the horizon for a massive hovering UFO. The self planetfall is clarified to. A question can it arrive on the same turn as another spacecraft?
War Engine, 20cm, 5+, CC n/a, FF 5+
4 x Seeker Missiles75cm AT6+ Guided Missiles
Twin-linked Heavy Railcannon105cm MW2+ Titan Killer (D3), Fixed Forward Arc
3 x Twin-linked Long-barrelled Ion Cannon90cm AP3+/AT3+, Fixed Forward Arc
Multiple Long-barrelled Burst Cannons30cm4 x AP4+/AA6+
Support Craft, Planetfall, Markerlight, Reinforced Armour, Tau Deflector Shield, Fearless, Damage Capacity 10. Critical Hit Effect: The Manta’s shield control systems are damaged and the deflector shield fails. It is unavailable for the remainder of the game. Further Critical hits will cause an additional point of damage. Transport  (may carry 38 infantry units, with battlesuits taking two slots each. Up to 12 light vehicles may be carried, taking two slots each. Up to 4 armoured vehicles may be carried taking 7 infantry spaces each, or 5 if they are Devilfish).
Note that the Manta is a space capable craft, and therefore does not require space assets in order to planetfall. Normal planetfall rules apply, including the designation of the planetfall turn and plotting a drop zone, placing the Manta as the space craft. The manta must choose an action (sustain, assault etc), successfully activate and then descends to ground level at its planetfall drop zone and immediately conducts its activation, any troops on board are treated as in a WE transport and may disembark after the Manta has moved and fire/assault with it.

Lastly the Hero. The weapons load in Epic is half the BFG load so its carrying too many torps, which dovetails neatly with 4 separate attacks being too much for some enemies to cope with. I would like people to consider making it init 1+ to stop a curious anti marine air assault army. It toasts grounded thunderhawks and some players use this as a turn 1 deterrent, and if it work use a retain to activate it, actively trying to fail the roll and have it as a threat next turn. Leads to the rules question of can you SC a successful activation.
2x Pin-point attack, MW2+
Gravitic Tracer Salvo, 3xMW6+ Guided Missiles

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"Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography."
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The army list

Formation sizes are adjusted for several reasons.
First off to match FW pack sizes. For instance the 12 strong Firewarriors match two packs of devilfish, two of firewarriors and you mix in a pack of drones. Tanks come in 6’s with upgrades in 3’s.
Secondly to by and large increase formation sizes (piranha being the exception). This limits abuse of co-ord fire and allows the Tau to slaughter the enemy at close range by simple virtue of having more dice to roll. Also larger formations give more average results and are easier to playtest as a result!
GM formations like the Piranha get smaller, again to limit abuse of co-ord and give them more of a support not main attack feeling (this isn’t the case in the armour list).

The upgrades (like skyray) may seem under priced. This is accounted for in the core formations cost both to allow more finer pricing and to encourage larger formations which in turns helps moderate the special rules. As by and large ML’s are available in support units it also encourages linked up Tau play. The list has lots of little things like that to encourage certain styles, but doesn’t, hopefully, make it a one trick pony, still giving the player a lot of flexibility and the ability to even make a tank/mech effective army if they so wish (not only because its the cheapest one to buy!).

The core formations are all firewarriors and relative restrictions are based on certain formations. This allows far finer pricing. The 8 FW/4 Devilfish formation is clearly intended to go in a manta and is priced as if it were. In fact it should only be points efficient when used in that way, like assault marines. Likewise the foot mounted one can be a garrison (though perhaps not as speedbumpy as humans) or Orca dropped and pointed as such. FW with devilfish are exponentially better than on foot and including the Dfish makes pricing easier to do. I really need tau names though! And of course a list of core formations one long is awful!

Initially upgrades were for everyone but this could be abused so sadly it’s become more complex again

Stuff like drones are excellent cheap upgrades and I would expect every formation to get them! The LV upgrades are out, stuff like Piranha should oerate like frightful hot Sentinels, but giving them Tetras to co-ord there gm attacks is too much, so goes. Likewise pathfinders are the infantry list ML of choice (well skyrays are, but we can pretend) so the tetra upgrade is related to the armour list.

Attached then is the infantry list in all its glory. The armour one will take a little longer, and is entirely theory as I haven’t been able to test it. It is sketched out though with tanks and mech infantry as core, kroot air born assaulters, vespid support and AP guided missiles. The big boys are all there and the Manta is in the support not air category. The Moray is currently tricky – I was wondering without a Warlord equivalent would it fix the unit if it became a formation of three for 8-900 points and was a warlord equivalent not warhound, leaving that gap for the scorpionfish. Funnily enough of the two lists I prefer the armour, but I do like tanks and even bigger tanks. The removal of the generic Tau way of war and the ‘Epic’ focus helps too!

CS the list attached is different to the one I sent you a week? back, it got revised after a short playtest last weekend when we found the points for a lot of stuff a bit high/low and support/upgrade combos being too much.

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General Plumer, 191x

And the word version.

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'Abolish red trousers?! Never! Red trousers are France!' – Eugene Etienne, War Minister, 1913
"Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography."
General Plumer, 191x

Since I can't sleep here's a rough draft with zero testing and not much thought Tau armoured list.

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'Abolish red trousers?! Never! Red trousers are France!' – Eugene Etienne, War Minister, 1913
"Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography."
General Plumer, 191x

I've had a quick look through the infantry list and like it.

I really like how the list has to be built around the fire warriors

Other comment wise:

I would only allow stealths to upgrade with more stealths.

Combine the Piranhas and Tetras to make them easy to buy formations.

Your Manta looks interesting.  Much lighter on weapns, but has a decent transport

I would drop the AX-2-2 from this list and have it in a variant list that uses more drones.  If it is to be in the list then I would have the remoras as seperate planes (so you buy a formation of an AX-2-2 and 2 Remoras).  Then have a unit special rule that allows thew remoras to have a 360 degree fire arc and to make flak attacks when the-AX 2-2 is still alive.

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Tyranid air marshal