Login |  Register |  FAQ
   
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 106 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next

Development Plan

 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 1:01 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2007 1:49 am
Posts: 5569
It's 55cm, as -5cm movement is part of the proposal.

Previously they could move 50, shoot, then jump back 10 when assaulted for 60cm of movement. That is actually reduced to 55.




_________________
http://www.troublemakergames.co.uk/
Epic: Hive Development Thread


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 3:13 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2005 1:24 am
Posts: 4499
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Can someone please answer my question?

Ignoring their speed for the moment, how is moving back 15cm after moving to within 30cm of the enemy any better than jumping back 10cm with jet packs when an engagement is decalred?

You're still out of range to engage....


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 3:25 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2007 1:49 am
Posts: 5569
It encourages the use of the 15cm ranged guns, can't happen several times in a turn and allows other formations other than the one shot at a chance to engage.

Most importantly, it forces the Tau player to decide which direction to move in before he knows where the enemy is going to be engaging from.




_________________
http://www.troublemakergames.co.uk/
Epic: Hive Development Thread


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 4:10 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2005 1:24 am
Posts: 4499
Location: Melbourne, Australia
It encourages the use of the 15cm ranged guns,

I disagree in general. The moment I read the proposal I was immediately looking at a 30cm range for the 2 other weapons each with a 30cm+ range. I still couldn't be engaged. I'd use MW in a gamble/all-or-nothing attack only.

can't happen several times in a turn .
Then why not just change Jetpacks to say "only the first engagement declaration in a turn" or something to that effect?
and allows other formations other than the one shot at a chance to engage
Are you saying people never set up other formations to do this??? If you are, then they are shooting themselves in the foot. Really, if you can't manoeuvre your forces to set up an engagment on Crisis suits then there's something wrong. Air assault as the only way to engage them well is a falacy. It really is.


Most importantly, it forces the Tau player to decide which direction to move in before he knows where the enemy is going to be engaging from.
I think this is falacy too. Seriously 10cm jump back is bugger all in terms of facing two formations. Giving them 15cm jump back doesn't really make any difference to your reasoning here as I automatically know that I will jump back 15cm before they can engage. I'll simply move to within 30cm get my 8 shots and back off out of engagement range.

This proposal adds nothing to Jetpacks. It's a red herring.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 4:29 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2007 1:49 am
Posts: 5569
Quote: (Dobbsy @ 06 Nov. 2008, 03:10 )

This proposal adds nothing to Jetpacks. It's a red herring.

Having playtested it several times I can say with certainty that it's a lot less annoying to play against.

_________________
http://www.troublemakergames.co.uk/
Epic: Hive Development Thread


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 7:38 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 4:45 pm
Posts: 8139
Location: London
I still mean to do proper replys to these threads and they are half done but sadly work is intervening. Something that should change with the jump packs is the amount of rules questions they generate. It seems every time I use them another query comes up.

_________________
If using E-Bay use this link to support Tac Com!
'Abolish red trousers?! Never! Red trousers are France!' – Eugene Etienne, War Minister, 1913
"Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography."
General Plumer, 191x


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 1:19 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire
Quote: (zombocom @ 06 Nov. 2008, 03:29 )

Quote: (Dobbsy @ 06 Nov. 2008, 03:10 )

This proposal adds nothing to Jetpacks. It's a red herring.

Having playtested it several times I can say with certainty that it's a lot less annoying to play against.

I second this... having playtested it around a dozen times, this version of the 'can't catch me!' Special Rule is less annoying, and disrupts the flow of play less too.

It also allows the conventional 'Move first unit into Support range, then engage with second unit on a Retain' tactic, which the current Jetpackers are nigh-immune to.




_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 1:26 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 8:59 pm
Posts: 1212
Location: Finland
Even though I don't fully agree with that E&C and zombos proposal, I admit it does sound better than current rule.

_________________
Rats Keep Running...

Dark Eldar Dracon


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 10:01 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2005 1:24 am
Posts: 4499
Location: Melbourne, Australia
It also allows the conventional 'Move first unit into Support range, then engage with second unit on a Retain' tactic, which the current Jetpackers are nigh-immune to

Sorry, but I still fail to see how this is any better than current rules and totally disagree with your nigh-immune comment. If you can't get into engagement range with a 10cm jump back, then you won't get into range with a 15cm post-firing jump back as the suits are further away than they would have been before. You can't engage with the support formation(as it moved first into support range) OR the Assault formation as the suits will be too far away. As Hena puts it, it's a bogus argument.

To assault suits you have to have incorporated the 10cm jump back into your movement equation for engagement. If you're doing anything else you will not engage the suits. It's that simple. A 15cm move back makes it even more difficult.

Can you give a playtest example?

BTW shouldn't this discussion be in Aspect:Units??





Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 10:53 am 
Hybrid
Hybrid

Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2005 1:32 pm
Posts: 4893
Location: North Yorkshire
Just a quick chip in to support Dobbsy.

I am also confused as to why the 15cm move after shooting rule is better than jetpacks.

Using E&C's example of moving support up and then engaging. I place the support on the other side of the Tau to then prevent them from jumping back out of engage range. Job done, no?

_________________
_________________
www.epic-uk.co.uk - home of the UK Epic tournament scene
NetEA NetERC Xenos Lists Chair
NetEA Ork + Feral Ork + Speed Freak Champion


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 12:45 pm 
Swarm Tyrant
Swarm Tyrant
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:22 pm
Posts: 9348
Location: Singapore
Quote: (Tiny-Tim @ 07 Nov. 2008, 09:53 )

Using E&C's example of moving support up and then engaging. I place the support on the other side of the Tau to then prevent them from jumping back out of engage range. Job done, no?

I have to admit that this is how I do it... when I play against the Tau (which is rare these days).

_________________
https://www.cybershadow.ninja - A brief look into my twisted world, including wargames and beyond.
https://www.net-armageddon.org - The official NetEA (Epic Armageddon) site and resource.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Development Plan
PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2008 4:48 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2005 12:13 am
Posts: 8711
Location: Leipzig, Germany, Europe, Sol III, Orion Arm, Milky Way, Local Group, Virgo Supercluster, Universe
What about to give them simply 25cm move with Jumppacks (or Skimmer without PopUp).
Nothing else? No special rule.

Really. The way Tau Jetpacks and Jumppacks work in Wh40k doesn't justify something special to differentiate them in Epic (other that Jetpack units doesn't double the Movement of Infantry units as Jumppacks do which represents that Jetpack units in Wh40k are in fact slower than Jumppack units).
Good armour is all what they need to represent that they can zip in and out of cover during shooting while other Infantr has to remain stationary to fire heavy weapons. And they already have a 3+ save which is good enough.




_________________
We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 106 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


Powered by phpBB ® Forum Software © phpBB Group
CoDFaction Style by Daniel St. Jules of Gamexe.net