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The manta!
Moscovian
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 4:06 pm 
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I leave this here for reference only, since it is the only unit in Epic that comes close to the Manta and is priced at 750 points.

Less firepower, more cargo capacity, 50 points more, and by most accounts well balanced internally and externally.

Code Sample: 
EXECUTOR LANDING MODULE
Type Speed Armour Close Combat Firefight
War Engine 25cm 5+ - 4+
Weapons Range Firepower Notes
Disintegrator Array 60cm 2 x AA4+
Heavy Phantom Lance 60cm MW3+ Titan Killer (D3), Fixed
Forward Arc
Twin Desolators 30cm 4BP Disrupt, Forward Arc
Hail of Splinters 45cm 3 x AP4+/AT6+ -
and (15cm) Small Arms Extra Attacks (+2)
Damage Capacity 6. Critical Hit: Weapon systems damaged. All weapons listed stop functioning including extra attacks
and Firefight value drops to 6+. Additional critical hits will cause an extra point of damage.
Notes: Support Craft, Free Planetfall, Shadowfield (4), Reinforced Armor, Fearless, Webway Portal, Transport (may
carry eight of the following: Light Vehicles, Armored Vehicles or War Engines. War Engines count as their starting
damage capacity in spaces each. In addition, the Executor may carry up to 16 infantry units of any type).

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BlackLegion
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 5:01 pm 
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You should not that the Manta in Wh40k Apocalypse is DC10 but it is a Super Heavy Flyer which means that i is more likely to suffer a Chain Reaction on the Super-Heavy Vehicle Damage Table.
Roll a 4 = Engine Damage but on SH Flyers = Chain Reaction
Roll a 5 = -1DC
Roll a 6 = Chain Reaction = -1DC and roll again

So this is a justification why the War Engine Aircrafts in Epic don`t have as much DC as their Wh40k counterpart.




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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 6:20 pm 
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Quote: (Rug @ Dec. 18 2009, 11:29 )

I thought the aim was to have the Manta a quite a common sight on the battlefield? Far more so than Warlords....

I would have thought they would be as common as Reavers?

Quote: 

TRC... you still havnt detailed any non orbital drop strategies for the Manta, are there any good ones?


I haven't got any. Hence the upgrade ideas giving them a boost on the ground whilst not affecting the drop balance. They are currently about as usable as Warlords.

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BlackLegion
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2009 9:52 pm 
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Well how common is the Manta? What is its role?
The full name in Battlefleet Gothic is Manta Missile Destroyer. The name implies that it is an attack craft. But it also has a considerable troop transport capacity.
To wuote BFG Armada:
Quote: 

"As with their starships, Tau attack craft is operated by the Air Caste, who
provide pilots for the Barracuda fighters and Manta bombers. Both of these
forms of attack craft also form an important part of Tau forces planetside,
with the Mantas transporting whole Hunter cadres consisting of dozens of
Fire Warriors while Barracudas provide air support."


In the fluff of IA3 it says right in the beginning:
"
Quote: 

The Manta is the Tau's super-heavy dropship"

And a bit further:
Quote: 

"It is well armed and armoured for use in frontline combat, where it is expected to deploy and fight as an attack craft."


So to me this sounds exactly like an uparmed Space Marine Landing Craft.
It can directly deploy in the face of the enemy, shoot the crap out of them, unload it's troops and take of again to provide air support or extract/reposition troops.

Maybe it should enter the table as if it where a Bomber but afterwards behaves as an always popped up Skimmer.

Or if you weant greater survivability make Tau Deflector Shields a 4+ Invulnerable Save.




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Onyx
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 1:10 am 
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Quote: 

Maybe it should enter the table as if it where a Bomber but afterwards behaves as an always popped up Skimmer.

BL, you've suggested that before and it wasn't accepted then. Not much has changed.

I do agree with you however, that the Manta is a frontline combat unit. One parked itself over the occupied Hydro Plant (Indepenence Day style) and shot the stuffing out of the Imperials. No dropping off behind the front lines and then shooting from long range there!

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BlackLegion
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 1:20 am 
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Quote: (Onyx @ Dec. 20 2009, 01:10 )

BL, you've suggested that before and it wasn't accepted then. Not much has changed.

Did i? I knew it felt familiar  :grin:

Well Planetfall is almost the same.

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Ginger
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 1:28 am 
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Does anybody else have a problem with a transport that is "always popped up"? So are the transported units equipped with parachutes or what??

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BlackLegion
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 1:30 am 
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The Manta can lower the transport bay to the ground iirc (buti don't see that in the pictures at FW).
Besides all units except Fire Warriors and Kroot are Skimmer or have Jet Packs.

In WH40k Apocalypse the Manta is a Flyer with Hover Mode. Moves like Aircrafts but can decide to switch to being a Skimmer.




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Chroma
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 4:20 am 
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Quote: (Ginger @ Dec. 20 2009, 00:28 )

Does anybody else have a problem with a transport that is "always popped up"? So are the transported units equipped with parachutes or what??

I believe, in the original proposal discussion, that the wording was supposed to be "always counts as popped-up for line of sight purposes".

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 9:05 am 
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Look its got a markerlight :)


This is the size of the beast for dc people out there

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Moscovian
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 2:13 pm 
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Quote: 

Look its got a markerlight


You have to love the logic of that.

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Onyx
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 2:17 pm 
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Yes, even the Epic (AI) scale model has a Markerlight on it.

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ronsandt
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:31 pm 
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JUST SO YOU KNOW  AND ILL ELABORATE LATER I JUST USED THE MANTA AT ROCKVILLE MD AND WON BOTH OF MY GAMES 3000PTS . ONE AGAINST THE HIVE AND ONE ON THE TITAN HEAVY IMPERIAL GAURD(NAME EXCAPES ME AT THE MOMENT)
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Honda
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 2:52 am 
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Please do give as much information as you can on how you used the Manta and how it performed. I'm guessing by the all caps, that you are pretty jazzed.  :grin:




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frogbear
 Post subject: The manta!
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 3:08 am 
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All Caps mean that I and others will simply refuse to read the post...

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