I think the primary complaint about Tau upgrades is that there are so many of them as "line items", and that each formation has its own "sub-set" of what are allowed... that 'complexity' what was the problem.

I really don't think adding two Tetras instead of three Tetras to a formation is adding "complexity"; it's adding flexibility.

And Orks seem to do fine with near infinite numbers of upgrades.

_________________
author of Syncing Forward and other stories...

It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.

+1    

Who said anything about "anything in any amount"?

I'm asking that the Tau have the option to field *LESS* than they do now.  There would be the same "maximum" numbers as now, with the "up to three upgrades" limit... so, are you saying an opponent would be fine seeing four Gun Drone units added to a formation, but would find only two added overly complex?

Aren't Tau noted for thier "organizational flexibility"?

_________________
"EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer

Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?

It's the same argument against allowing the Biel-tan to have the 4-Aspect unit troupe formation.  It was ONE formation, but it added flexibility to the list that would only make min-maxing easier.

'Organizational flexibility' - this could mean a great many things.  Carried to an extreme, why not just price out the units individually and cap the total number of units per formation at twelve?  Just piece the formations together any darn way you feel like it.  It's flexible, very Tau-ish, simple to list.  Come up with an argument against it.

The obvious argument is that it affords too much flexibility which equates to the list being overpowered.

_________________
author of Syncing Forward and other stories...

It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.

Actually, I think that would be brilliant!

Would allow the Tau to be completely unique from the more "regimented" races.  Price things at slightly higher than they are now per unit and go.

_________________
"EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer

Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?

Chroma, you exhaust me sometimes.  Don't you have something like five supplements that you are supposed to be working on?

While I think you COULD balance this type of list, it would trash all the work that came before and effectively reset everything back to zero.

Although this would be an interesting idea for variant lists for ALL races: set them up on a kind of salad bar and organize as you see fit.  Maybe we'll make ANOTHER supplement based on this idea!  
We'll call it..

Epic: Buffet

_________________
author of Syncing Forward and other stories...

It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.

I drink a lot of coffee, take a lot of B-Complex, and I don't have any kids...  

While I think you COULD balance this type of list, it would trash all the work that came before and effectively reset everything back to zero.

_________________
"EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer

Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?

One last thing... it's very (minorly) frustrating that, playing pure Tau, there's only one (limited) 25 point upgrade, and *no* 50 point upgrades... I dislike having points left over.

_________________
"EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer

Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?

The "buffet" armylist should be Space Marines

_________________
We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/

Why not make the buffet for everyone though.  Seriously.  If you are going to do this, why not?  It would be the ultimate in customization.  Modify the tournament rules that state that there is a target number of activations (ex. 10 for 3000 points) and each player cannot have more than 12 or less than 8 (preventing popcorn armies from attacking).  

I think you'd get some pretty strange lists put together but it would be fun occasionally.  Anyway, I've taken it way off topic.  To bring it back around, I don't see a Tau buffet working well in a tournament sense.  Something like this would have to be against other lists that could do the same thing- essentially creating a whole new set of lists.

_________________
author of Syncing Forward and other stories...

It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.

Okay, here comes a new player:

Wasnt the whole purpose of these lists for all armys to give a limited ability of customization for better balancing?

I mean, I am sure everybody knows a tabletop game where every miniature could have been taken for a price cost tailored only for that miniature?! Granted, those are mostly skirmish games. I guess there is a reason why this aspect is approached in skirmish games... Is Epic a skirmish game... pretty sure no.

I made a list today for a 3000 points game and actually I had it done earlier but with that 5.1 draft it didn't work as well imo. It took me 5 minutes to modify, considering the basic stuff. And about 20 minutes of fiddling around with my last 300ish points. Therefore I'd love a bit more flexibility.

But not in creating new balance issues. I guess its a fine line to wander and I am supporting Honda on that. This list needs playtesting as it is now. We can talk about customization later. Especially right now I want to play with one list and not every other week with minor tweaks. Just tried the new Firewarrior today and I like them better, not good, but better.

(For the record, I lost that game against Death Guard horribly... Not sure, but three titans and two plague towers are too much. I had never ever enough firepower for that.
Getting back to that thread, because looking at the death guard lists: They have customization posibilities in there...)

I made a list today for a 3000 points game and actually I had it done earlier but with that 5.1 draft it didn't work as well imo. It took me 5 minutes to modify, considering the basic stuff. And about 20 minutes of fiddling around with my last 300ish points. Therefore I'd love a bit more flexibility

Because a lot of armies/races are a lot more "regimented" in their organizational, and even combat, doctrines; being the "ultimate in flexibilty" would make the Tau army unique.

Anyway, I whipped up a "Buff'Et Sept Army List" and put it in the Other Forces forum.

_________________
"EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer

Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?