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[BatRep] Tau vs. Orks

 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 8:23 am 
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Quote (Breten @ 10 Jan. 2006 (06:39))
In the morphine induced haze she says to me, "Hey, I'll have lots of time to paint miniatures."  Think I'll keep her.:)

:wow:  I wouldn't let go of her if I was you...

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 5:11 pm 
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Glad to hear the GF is at least keeping spirits up... so any chance you can at least give is the 5-min summary on how things ended - bat rep to be finished later with maps... I for one am eager anticipating how your battle went with the orks.

All the best to your GF's fast recover as well.  :8):

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 7:41 pm 
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I'm not sure how good the paintjobs will be, if she's really stoned on morphine/ percoset/vicadin, but she's definitely a keeper.  Hope the surgery goes well, and she gets better.

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 10:02 pm 
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Turn 2 was a blood bath. ?The Shas?el?s Cadre opened fire upon the Warband holding Objective 2 with the Deth Koptas, whittling the large warband down to a few stands & trucks. ?The foolish Orcs stood where they were. ?The advacncing Blitz Brigade came over the crest of the hill peppering the Crisis Cadre, nearly breaking them, while the Deth Koptas opened fired on the Ion-Head contingent eliminating a single tank. ?The Broadsides fired upon the retreating blitz brigade polishing off the vestiges. ?The Shas?O and Warlord took potshots at each other, but to the dismay of the green horde, the Orc warlord was slain the by the Tau Shas?El. ?The Firewarriors took some casualties from the advancing Killa Kans, with their transports managing to take out some of the clunky Orc walkers. ?The AMHC also opened fire on the Blitz Brigade that was coming up behind the Warlord?s warband, enraged ?by the loss of their leader. ?Though the brigade took casualties and fled the scene they took out a Hammerhead with them. ?A roar filled the skies as the Barracudas made an attack run on the Orcs camped at the objective on the right flank.  Hearing the fighters coming the Orcs swung into action, and let loose a fury of shots at the planes, taking one out on the flyby as the shots from the Barracuda ripped through the Warband, taking out all of it's gunwagonz and some Infantry.  As the Barracudas looked back to assess the damage, they were picked off out of the sky by some anti-aircracft fire as they flew by another unit.  The Tigershark survived it's attack run, saluting his fallen Air caste pilots as he flew by the wreckage.

Things looked dire for the Tau on the right flank. ?The Crisis team was near breaking, and the Ion heads were down to 3 tanks. ?He still had a Blitz Brigade fast approaching and a lot of stuff in the warband was still around. ?And that?s not counting the 7 or 8 Deth Koptas he still had supporting that objective.

(Map to come)






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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 10:16 pm 
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Bretan,

Heh - you and chroma are killing me... I need to go find something else to do until you two get done!

LOL  :cool:

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 11:21 pm 
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Quote (Honda @ 08 Jan. 2006 (13:28))
Breten,

GREAT maps!!!

1. What program did you use to draw these?
2. I've seen a bunch of fonts online to support 40K, in fact I've got the Tau one. Is that what you used for your text?
3. Would it be possible to add some arrows to indicate where units moved from?

I'm really looking forward to the next turns.

Thanx for sharing.

The maps I drew using AutoCAD, and then made them into a PDF, then saved those as JPG's :)  I'm a draftsman so it really didn't take that long to put together, then it's just moving the objects around.  

The fonts are indeed GW fonts.  At least the Tau one is.  The Orc one I found online, and it's called Orc Glyphs or something like that.  

I'll add in the arrows to the maps, as well as have the last 2 maps up sometime tomorrow.  

All the scenery were indeed hills, as we didn't have a lot of scenery to spread out as we actually had a couple games going on.  There were a lot so it was all good in the end.  I'd definately prefer some more smaller stuff to help hide those Crisis suits.

Rick didn't take the Fighta Bommas as he didn't have any at that point, though he did pick up a blister after our game.  No clue about the Landa.


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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 11:29 pm 
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The turning point was close.  If the Tau could keep their right flank from crumbling, we stood a chance of obtaining victory.   Emboldened by the destruction of the Tau flyers, the Ork Warlord?s warband assaulted the Shas?O and his Cadre to get revenge for the loss of the boss.  The battle was vicious but thatnks to the nearby support of the AMHC and the Firewarriors, the Tau successfully broke the remaining Warband, and the Firewarriors managed to finish off the fleeing tide of greenskins.  The AMHC, sensing victory, fired upon the remaing blitz brigade coming on the left, and in a hail of railgun slugs, made swiss cheese out of the Orks armour.  The Shas?o and his Cadre then moved forward taking the objective, while the Firewarriors hung back at their objective.  The Broadsides, garrisoned at the Ork Objective moved forward slightly trying to get a bead on the Deth Koptas that were plaguing the right flank.  Taking out 3 Deth Koptas, the Tau strengthened their hold of the right flank, while the Ion head contingent managed to finish off the blitz brigade.  All that was left was for the Shas?el to eliminate the remainder of the Ork Warband.  Unfortunately for the Tau, the Warband managed to hold their position, contesting the objective.  

At the end of the third turn, the Orks, sensing total annihilation, withdrew from the battlefield to fight another day.

At the end of the game, the only thing the Orks had left on the table was a broken Blitz Brigade, and a few vestiges of the warband on the right flank, with a couple Deth Koptas.  The only thing the Tau lost during the engagement was a single Broadside Battlesuit, both upgrades of Stealthsuits, an Ion-Head, 2 Hammerheads, a couple stands of Firewarriors and 5 or 6 stands of Crisis suits, the majority coming from the right flanking unit.

(Map to come)

All in all, It was a good game, though it seemed a bit one sided at the end, the 2nd turn could have gone either way, and with a few good moves I managed to save myself from losing that flank.  A couple observations:

Deth Koptas with a 4+ save are very nice indeed.  

Orcs don?t have a lot of Firepower, and it was only due to my surrounding units that I managed the win against his assaulting Warlord.

Crisis suits are fantastic against Orc infantry, but if they have support in the form of Gunwagonz and what not, then add in some Ion-Heads or Hammerheads to help you out with that AT punch if you don?t have any AT support nearby to handle them.  As has been said here before, when they get close, they get hurt.  That said I definitely like my loadout of two Crisis Squads against Orcs.  He took an Infantry heavy army so it paid off.  Against an armour heavy force, I may drop them down in numbers and turn them into specialist tank hunters or something like that.  

Garrisoning the Broadsides was a great idea.  They were mostly ignored due to the size of the unit, until he took all the damage, however he didn?t get to do much against them as they were a well hidden unit, and then the Ion-heads finished off what they didn?t.  I?ll beusing my Hammerhead contingent as support for my forward deployed broadsides, what they don?t hit, the HH?s seem to mop up.  I wouldn?t take more than one unit, but they definitely earned a permanent place in my lists.

Networked Drones are a Godsend.  It?s nice to be able to pull those extra BMs? off your AMHC.

The Tigershark I am not too sure about.  It took out a few things, but I?m not sure if it was worth it.  It?s also possible I?m not using it right as I don?t have drones, so I don?t do the drone drop, and it seems to me that it only gets 1 MW shot 1 AP and 1 AT shot, so at most you can hit is 2 targets either AP or AT.  Any suggestions as what I?m doing wrong might help me out.

I?m very happy with my force for the moment.  I?m definitely adding in some more stuff as I felt I could use some more AT spread across my line.  I also need to learn how to use Co-ordinated Fire better to my adavantage as it was non-existant in my usage.  The same goes for Markerlights, I need to use them more.


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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:30 am 
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Ahh - its better with the drone objective contestor/crossfire assistor, or just with railguns.

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 7:13 am 
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I did run the railgun version, but it can only take out 1 thing at a tme with the railguns, and as he didn't have even any Stompas it felt like a point-sink.  I'll likely leave it out, if I face a similar force, in favour of another Barracuda Squadro or more tanks.


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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 1:52 pm 
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It is a good warboss killer in that case. Run over to the warboss so it is the closest target and TK it. Orks minus SC rerolls are easier to deal with :) Remember you don't have to stop outside a target formation - you can go in (good advice for marines air assualting imperials that as well).

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 3:46 pm 
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What Chris said.

Without flak to deal with, you can essentially use aircraft to snipe specific targets.  Good "sniping" style targets would be the warboss and the oddboyz.

If you don't want to be cheesy (I personally hate the idea of sniping with aircraft), you should still be able to do significant damage to the armor.  With 3 Blitz Brigades, you shouldn't run out of targets.  Each pass averages about 1.5 kills.  With 3 passes, you're pretty close to getting your points back just from those kills.  Deth Koptas have a higher armor and are most likely to be out of LoS of other units, so they would be a good target for aircraft-mounted TK and MW.  

Another good use would be to hammer any broken formations.  With hack-down hits, you should be getting 3-4 kills in one pass.

Basically, even with cheap (25-35 point) targets you should easily be able to "reclaim" points spent on the Tigershark just with straight kills.

If that's not enough, they provide additional value by adding suppression to key formations as needed or breaking a formation that's already close to the edge.

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 8:12 pm 
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Bretan,

I hear what you are saying about the TS. Note: drones are only an option if you take the ion-cannon version. If you take the light railcannon version, its at a higher points and no drone transport option.

The new 4.3.3 version tones down the FP of the AX-1-0. It takes the shooting from 3+ to 4+. Targets that are in cover used to only get hit on 4+ and now will only get hit on 5+. This will definitely take its toll on the effectiveness of the AX-1-0's main weapon system and the impression of effectiveness may directly result from:

1) opponen't army composition
- if he doesn't take big toys and heavy infantry, the AX-1-0 will not seem as effective.

2) how he uses cover
- if he puts everything in cover and continues to do so turn after turn (ruins, forest, jungle, etc) the impact to your recently reduced FP will only go down.

Regards the suggestion to snipe - this IMHO is a flaw in the main rules. I do not think sniping should be permitted with Aircraft. I suppose I'm disagreeing with TRC's advice and agreeing with NH's opinion of the tactic.

Using Aircraft to stop over an enemy formation and shoot at a character stand in order to make it the closest target is very gamey and very unrealistic IMHO. Is it legal, yes. Is it going to make you any friends in the epic circle - not likely. So do whatever you feel is appropriate on that front. We are playtesting afterall. Be mindful though however, exploiting problematic rules in the main list when playtesting a development list does not tell us whether the development list is working - it just tells us whether we can exploit main list loopholes. The value to that feedback regarding army list devleopment is... well...

I can talk about playing against no flak enemy armies, but those should be far and few between. Besides, the summary result is - do what you want - the enemy didn't protect himself!!! "Doh!" I don't think you'll find that enemy not having flak becomes a norm for you. Typically, players grow to learn that a significant amount of flak is better than none at all. Be forwarned.

Regards to value of the TS (or AX-1-0 variant) in its current v4.3.3 state, I think there is still value to be had. NH basically covered it.

You can still place blast markers. This can be big in turn 3, if you push a turn 4 it can be huge as this is an objective based game. Airsupport is only as good as the ground it can free up for the objective grabbing foot sloggers below.

In earlier turns, after delivering a good ground based attack to an enemy formation. Look for opportunities to break a unit with aircraft so a larger punishing ground formation can follow up after the plane strike and place blast markers to rid the broken formation from the field.

In the end game, look for the opportunity to break formations in hard to reach locations so you can take objectives away or eliminate activations to force earlier than ideal plays. You'd be surprised at the value this can generate to you on turn 3 and 4 late in the turns.

Artillery formations are usually fragile and hard to get too. Eldar enemy vehicles can be a real pain with their hit and run techniques. Consider early elimination of artillery and hidden annoying long range foramtions with your aircraft. However, be concious of dealing with the majority of the ground based flak first - or make your approach with a calculated risk that appears to be in your favor. Consider flying off the table edge or the opponents edge to avoid being shot at. More blast markers are one thing and they will go away no matter what the result of your activation attempt next turn. That may be a better alternative than flying into a fray of enemy AA.

Actiavtion advantage. Sometimes its good to just to a glancing hit to an enemy formation with your planes, just to stall one more activation or two before activating the hidden and well placed ground formation of choice. Using relatively cheaper air formations to force more opponent activations can have intangible value that doesn't necessarily _directly_ equate to 'points earned' from firing the aircraft formation's weapon systems.

Regards to your report, I look forward to the maps and arrows. It will be interesting to see how your opponent does as he gets more games under his belt. I think the orcs are a deadly force. I also think they have quite a bit of shooting potential that can really be brutal against the Tau. They can take a serious amount of BP upgrades too.

It he aquires a landa or two and 9 fighta bombers - look out! You will have a new appreciation for air superiority and first turn damage potential. The orks have the potential to rapid strike, have the numbers to create combat bonus' have the staying power to threaten your lines, and have the blast capable BP potential to make you regret any reliance on CF tactics. I'll look forward to your next two or three reports against this adversary.

In regards to the Crisis, I think you have it. In order to deal with the AT threat, they may not be the best choice. From Chroma's recent report, it looks like the crisis have the elite feel they have been lacking. From both of your reports, it would appear the network drones are a welcome and much needed upgrade to the AMHC - that's great to hear.

I'm suprised the broadsides went basically unscathed in this battle. I wonder if you will maintain the 'staple' inclusion of them in your force over games to come. Their LV status may remove some deployemnt opportunities over time and force you to cosider either upgrading the formation or delivering them to the field via orca. It will be interesting to see your perception of this formation devlop over time.

Thank you very much for the report - congrats on the win too. A good change of pace from your last report for you I suspect. Sorry to hear this on felt one sided in the late game. I think that might have quite a bit to do with relative experience levels, advice, and available models on your opponent's side. He's playing a strong list. Look for some improvement there.

I personally like playing against challenging opponents with strong lists both in playtest and in general. If you want to broaden his orky tactics, I'd encourage him to jump on some orc boards. In the interum, have him explore the BP upgrades available in his list, **landa** with aircraft assaults, and fighta bomba potential in his lists. He'll be thanking you and your games should become quite a bit more exciting. ;)

Cheers,

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Tau vs. Orks
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 6:43 pm 
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I'm sorry to all I haven't finished off the maps as I just haven't had the time.  Between work and taking care of the girlfriend, and since we don't live together at the moment, I'm hardly home.  I should hopefully have some free time this weekend if anyone still wants to see them.


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