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Odd situation
Ilushia
 Post subject: Odd situation
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 6:53 pm 
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Sitting around reading battle reports and waiting for my Warlords to arrive in the mail (mmm.. Stompy death!) something odd occured to me.  If you give a Titan both a Devotional Bell and a Veteran Princepts (Or Legate for that matter) It has two copies of Leader. I'm rather wondering, how does this work? Does it actually gain the benefit of two copies of leader, like if you have more then one Leader stand in a single formation? Do they over-lap eachother and give you no extra benefit? I'd lean towards the prior, really. The only other army I can think of which can do this is an Ork army placing an Ork Warlord in with a group of Nobz, and I'm rather currious as to how you people think it should work?
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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Odd situation
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 7:18 pm 
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Another one is the marine supreme commander. People are split, I think one per instance of leader, but others think otherwise.

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Ilushia
 Post subject: Odd situation
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 7:40 pm 
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Another good example, also in the AMTL list, is Inspiring. If you give a Titan both a Devotional Bell and a Sacred Icon, not hard to do if you're going for a melee-monster, what happens? Do you get +2 to resolution for having two copies of Inspiring? I'd say yes, since Inspiring notes that you do this specifically, multiple copies of Inspiring stack, but it is only one model... I'm of the opinion that both should stack, mostly because otherwise you're paying for something you're not really getting. Space Marine Supreme Commanders should really too. You're paying twice the normal price for rights to re-roll one failed Initiative test per turn otherwise, since normal Commanders get Commander. That seems awful steep in an army which already has 1+ Initiative...
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dafrca
 Post subject: Odd situation
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 7:49 pm 
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The original intent when we added these back when I was the champ was tmost things, like Leader, would NOT stack. We were trying to allow the benifit to be added through different means, for example, a bell would be a conversion, but the Veteran Princepts was something you could add on your own.

Course, once I had to drop out, it went where ever the new Champion & team wanted it to go. :p

dafrca

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nealhunt
 Post subject: Odd situation
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 7:57 pm 
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Whether it stacks depends on the ability and how the rule is written.  Generally speaking, I think special abilities should stack.

Inspiring, however, does not stack.  The description of the ability specifically states that each "unit" with Inspiring adds +1 to resolution, not that you get +1 per Inspiring.

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clausewitz
 Post subject: Odd situation
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 10:14 pm 
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Inspiring, however, does not stack.  The description of the ability specifically states that each "unit" with Inspiring adds +1 to resolution, not that you get +1 per Inspiring.

Can't argue with the rules as written, but it does seem like WEs could have been made an exception here, as they are in some ways several units rolled into one. (e.g. the one basic CC/FF attack per DC, whereas units get just one basic CC/FF attack each)

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Lord Inquisitor
 Post subject: Odd situation
PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2006 10:25 pm 
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We had a discussion about this over in the SG rules forum, but my opinion is that no specialist unit ability should be able to be used more than once per unit.

I very much feel that a unit either has any given ability (say, Invulnerable Save) or it doesn't. It is a unit ability - either the unit has the leader ability or not: "double leader" isn't stipulated in the rules.

This interpretation is the simplest (otherwise we need to sort out which abilities stack - leader? - and which don't - invulnerable save?) and it is supported if not explicit in the rules. It's simple, sensible, it doesn't contradict the rules and it sorts out all these silliness about Supreme Commanders being "double leaders" and soforth.

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