I'm sorry you feel that way, but I did review that PM and I've not done anything outside of the parameters I laid out there. AMTL has seen only a slight boost to the God Machines rule to make it useful, which was what I said I'd probably do. Skitarii I mentioned the return of Robots and shifts to add more options to the demi-century for AT, AP, AA to help allow specialization. We tested that. Didn't work out as planned so we adjusted. There's still some specialization but it's not as much as I'd hoped. Everything else has been minor tweaks to units.

So far your only suggestions have been this:
Give Secutors MW for their long range shots
Leave minorii at 10cm or the universe will fall apart
Leave Corvus Minorii at 30cm
Make Rapiers a Support Formation - This was tried already and failed.
Remove Russes
Remove macharius
ork WE transport special rule

Of those, Secutors now have the MW shot
Minorii are being at least TESTED at 15cm
Rapiers we can put back as support, but they just don't get taken.
Remove russ and macharius - you know as well as I do that can't happened without people throwing a row.
I missed your suggestion about the transport rule. I'll look into it.

I'm sorry if I missed something, but that's not a whole lot of constructive input. Please remember that to date, nothing has actually changed in the AMTL/Skitarii list. Everything here is still just tentative changes being tested.

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-Vaaish

I've had some time to think on all of this and I want to apologize to E&C. My comments are very harsh especially with the effort he has pored out over the years to shape the AdMech lists. If it weren't for his contributions there wouldn't even really be a list as balanced and interesting as what we have now. My actions were short sighted and divisive with regard to the opinions expressed. It was not my intent but I allowed the emotion of the moment to carry my response. My insensitive and critical comments were the result, and for that I ask for forgiveness. I hope we can move forward and create a list that is balanced, fun, and unique to play.

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-Vaaish

No need to apologise, my opinions clearly are vastly outnumbered and I wish you all the best in getting the list balanced. I earnestly hope you can do it as I need a skitarii list or three for the next supplement.

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

What would people's thoughts be about limiting the Majoris to selecting weapons only from the Ordinatus weapons? That would drop the Majoris options from nearly 20 to just three. Although, to be fair, not many people would take a 2x CLP, corvus pod, lasburner, melta cannon, or CC weapon majoris so it's more like 15 realistic options.

It would have the effect of making the minorus the modular take what you want ad hoc Mechanicus superheavy with the majoris filling more the iconic centerpiece role. It also begs the question of how often does anyone take a majoris with anything other than the ordinatus weapons?

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-Vaaish

I'm fine with them as they are. I think there is little difference between a Majoris and a Reaver, aside from the named weapons. Even the Majoris can only take pairs.

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SG

Ghost's Paint Blog, where everything goes that isn't something else.

Well, the majoris does have a rather hefty bit of extras tacked on compared to the reaver... at a loss of FF and CC ability, fearless, and durability.

Another thought to throw around... how about instead of a percentage dedicated to allies, each core formation opens up one allies slot for titans or air support... even taking only demi-centuries you'd only be capable of fitting one more thunderbolt squadron in there than you can with the 33%.

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-Vaaish

I say keep it the way it is now. I've only ever used Ordinatus weapons, but that's due to the lack of a suitable model, not a lack of desire to use regular Titan weapons.

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"I don't believe in destiny or the guiding hand of fate." N. Peart

I have playtested the Majoris so you can take my comments with appropriate pinch of salt.

However what requirement do we have to allow Majoris complete access to all Titan weapons? It does nt have to be all or nothing. We could quite easily come up with say half a dozen Titan weapons, plus the Ordinatii weapons, to choose from. This would allow enough choice to cover those options already modelled by players, plus gives a bit more variety in battlefield role than say just the Ordinatii weapons. Yet if we restrict the number of weapon choices then it will make it easier to balance.

Just a thought for possible middle ground....

James

If you look at the titan weapons there really are only a couple that are even worth considering on the majoris.

You can immediately discount the CLP, Laser Burner, CCW, and Melta Cannon due to either lack of effect or slowness of the platform making them basically expensive blitz guard. Corvus pod too seems a bit useless regardless of speed boost for a 400 point transport.

That leave you with plasma cannon, Gatling blaster, and apoc launcher if you want a cheap majoris. There is some utility in the PC and GB, but the Apoc is far outclassed by the Mars for 50 points more which is well within the range of finding in your army list.

From the next level up, you have the Laser Blaster and Volcano cannon, both of these are useful.

Atthe 75 point bracket you are contending with the 150 point ordinatus weapons, but I think a case could be made for all of the ordinatus weapons performing slightly better than the these; plasma destructor has a lot going for it, but slow firing means I think the armageddon will pull through over the course of the game. Quake cannon is nice, but without taking a support minorus it's limited to LOS which makes the golgotha work slightly better I think. The support missile is only two shots so an alright choice but leave you with an expensive paper weight compared to a deathstrike detachment from a guard list or the ordinatus weapons.

so, basically, I think the only useful weapons on a majoris from the titan list are the Plasma Cannon, Gatling Blaster, Laser Blaster, and Volcano Cannon before you might as well take the ordinatus weapons.

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-Vaaish

I think destructors look excellent, great range an an awesome anti armour salvo that will remove whole marine or tank formations.

Quakes are overpriced IMO and should get a minor drop, then great. Obviously broken at same price with titans and CLP mind you.

Custom pricing as I've proposed fixes a lot of the imbalances.

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

Thanks Vaaish- would we need at least one Titan indirect fire weapon for the Majoris weapons? Or do you feel that this is sufficiently covered by Golgotha?

E&C- what do you make of the idea of more restricted choice of Majoris weapons? Ordinatii weapons plus a selection of some of the Titan weapons.

I know you were concerned at the- skitarii list being "bloated" and that number of options making it hard to balance. I would presume that this would help?

I don't think we really need another one with the Golgotha. If people really want to get indirect they can take the mars with a CLP minorus.
Perhaps some of the other ordunatus that E&C listed would completely cover all eventualities with the apoc gun and 2x destructor. Although either of those aren't entirely necessary.

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-Vaaish

Thanks Vaaish

What are other people's impressions of the restricted Majoris weapon choice that Vaaish suggested above? Looking at it, it should nt invalidate most people's scratchbuilt Majoris, and will reduce the number of options avaiable to Skitarii, making it less "bloated" and thus easier to balance.

I think it would be great if we could build some consensus on this as we could trim the army list without losing player impetus and enthusiasm.

Cheers

James

TBH, the majoris is about the only thing right now that would have any significant effect on the list in terms of possible options to balance. I don't want to see the minorus loose it's customization as that's a huge draw for what it's supposed to be covering. Anything else would be little more than symbolic.

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-Vaaish

Agreed