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Tyranid v7.3.1
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=8703		 Page 1 of 10
Author:  Chroma [ Mon Feb 19, 2007 8:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Tyranid v7.3.1
Greetings broodlings!

I've taken the liberty to clear up the v7.3 list to produce v7.3.1, no major rules have been changed, but a few units have been tweaked.

The major change is in layout; I've completely reorganized the list to replicate the setup in the "Swordwind" supplement. ?That does mean there are some "empty" sections, but it also means that all the special rules and sections are following proper EPIC numbering. ?Nothing has radically changed from 7.3.

Other Changes:
-Edited the various special rules to clarify them and make them a little less wordy; the rules themselves should still be the same so please go over them with a fine-toothed grooming claw to see if I unintentionally changed anything or made it more confusing.

-removed fearless from the Hierodules; yes they were fearless in Jaldon's 7.2 notes, but they were also only 75 points there and I think we can all agree that that's absurd! ?*laugh* ?The spread of fearless has been a bit of a point of contention and we should probably reduce before we reuse.

-returned Venom Cannon as Venomspitter Carnifex's primary weapon.

-reduced Malefactor's "Spine Banks" to +1EA FF instead of +2EA.

-changed Hormagaunt's FF to "none" instead of the incredible "0+".

-added a couple of "Design Concepts" to clarify some things Jervis had said long ago and to smooth out Spawning a bit.

Please take a look and let the Hive Mind know what you think!
Author:  ragnarok [ Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Tyranid v7.3.1
I love the winged warriors, I can now use mine (if only I could find an opponent :( ).  However I missed when warriors lost their venom cannon.  When did this happen?

I'm still not happy about the down sizing of mummy... er I mean the dominatrix and the lack of fearless on our Reaver equiverlent titan, but I guess I will have to just change my tactics and use cover for more than just snack food :D
Author:  Chroma [ Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Tyranid v7.3.1

(ragnarok @ Feb. 19 2007,20:24)
QUOTE
I love the winged warriors, I can now use mine (if only I could find an opponent :( ). ?However I missed when warriors lost their venom cannon. ?When did this happen?

Doh! ?The Warriors should have a Venom Cannon still! ?*sigh*

Ah, the Venom Cannon is there, just the formatting of the "underline" is in the wrong place.  *laugh*
Author:  Chroma [ Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Tyranid v7.3.1

(ragnarok @ Feb. 19 2007,20:24)
QUOTE
the lack of fearless on our Reaver equiverlent titan

I don't like that either, as the Hierophant is fearless in the Imperial Armour books, but I didn't want to change things up too much.

I mean, I've got tonnes of radical ideas, but I'm just a Hive Tyrant...  :alien:
Author:  Chroma [ Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:40 am ]
Post subject:  Tyranid v7.3.1

(Hena @ Feb. 19 2007,21:49)
QUOTE
Oh, I just noticed that Hierodules have fearless. I'm against that part very exceedingly much (or raise the cost to 175 at least). In my tests that won't be there.

Ah, I copied that from Jaldon's 7.2 without noticing it.

The thing is, in Imperial Armour, both Hierodules are specifically fearless.  Why do you think they *shouldn't* be in EPIC, Hena?  Mine still tend to die like... well, big crawling flies.
Author:  Markconz [ Tue Feb 20, 2007 3:22 am ]
Post subject:  Tyranid v7.3.1
Just getting my head around Hena's version and another one pops up!! :D

After all the discussion in the other thread on the trygons move not being good enough I am going with Hena's suggestion of 25cm and no infiltrate until further advised.

Also carnis - are we really keeping two? (Why'd I ever suggest it in the first place!). I'd advise dropping the VC version as they are not necessary in the epic list.  As stated in the other discussion the only reason I thought it might be a good idea was if the range was being resculpted (which it almost certainly isn't now).  If it is being kept the stats are inappropriate for twin VC. If you want high AP then rename the weapon to twin Barbed Strangler. VC's are hopeless against infantry but good against vehicles.
Author:  Chroma [ Tue Feb 20, 2007 3:38 am ]
Post subject:  Tyranid v7.3.1

(Markconz @ Feb. 20 2007,02:22)
QUOTE
Also carnis - are we really keeping two? (Why'd I ever suggest it in the first place!). I'd advise dropping the VC version as they are not necessary in the epic list. ?As stated in the other discussion the only reason I thought it might be a good idea was if the range was being resculpted (which it almost certainly isn't now). ?If it is being kept the stats are inappropriate for twin VC. If you want high AP then rename the weapon to twin Barbed Strangler. VC's are hopeless against infantry but good against vehicles.

I've always liked the two types of Carnies... heck, I wish there were more!  *laugh*

As to the Venom Cannon, I see what you're saying when I look at the 40k stats, but in all the EPIC lists it's been AP5+/AT6+, so "twinning" it, makes it a lot better at AP.

I considered giving it 2 x Venom Cannon AP5+/AT6+, but those extra shots might be too much.
Author:  Markconz [ Tue Feb 20, 2007 5:23 am ]
Post subject:  Tyranid v7.3.1

(Chroma @ Feb. 20 2007,01:38)
QUOTE
As to the Venom Cannon, I see what you're saying when I look at the 40k stats, but in all the EPIC lists it's been AP5+/AT6+, so "twinning" it, makes it a lot better at AP.

I considered giving it 2 x Venom Cannon AP5+/AT6+, but those extra shots might be too much.

Twinned or not those stats make no sense for VC's. All I'm saying is that it should be called 'Twin Barbed Stranglers' if you want to make it good at AP. Twin VC should be better at AT.

I was the one who originally suggested the 'Venomfex'. It could just as easily have been called the BarbedFex (which would make a pleasing parallel with the Barbed hierodule).
Author:  Hojyn [ Tue Feb 20, 2007 5:55 am ]
Post subject:  Tyranid v7.3.1
Hi,

good job, Chroma, it's nice to have an updated version!  :)

Overall I like it a lot, with a few exceptions:

- Unstopabble + Fearless is really a nasty combo

I think it should be limited to the Hydraphant and Synapse creatures. Not only that, but I can't see the logic behind this : why does a Hierodule have it and not a Hierophant? Why does a Carnifex have it and not a Malefactor? etc.

- Broodlord

I'm not too sure on that one. Inspiring makes it a mean beast, especially with Unstoppable.

- Nexus Group vs. Dominatrix

1D3+2 spawning seems better than 2D3 in terms of stability.

I suggested giving 1D3+3 to the Dominatrix, but as Hena pointed out, perhaps that would make uncommon brood and Hierodule respawning too easy? That said, it's the Dominatrix after all, she should be able to spawn big creatures.

- Dominatrix

Invulnerable Save to protect it from a 1st turn TK death?

1D3+3 & Invulnerable Save for +50 points?

- Winged Warriors

I love them, I really do, but don't you fear they will make the Harridan and Vituperator redundant?

Why take an expensive and vulnerable synapse creature when you can have 3 smaller but well protected ones?
Author:  thurse [ Tue Feb 20, 2007 11:07 am ]
Post subject:  Tyranid v7.3.1

A oui le Broodlord je trouve que cela fait gadget et jure dans la liste tyranids. Par contre si quelqu'un propose une liste culte Genestealer je serai d'accord pour le voir. Mais l?.... bof....

translation :
I think the broodlord feels like a gadget and doesn't belong to the list. However, if somebody submits a genestealer cult list. I'd be ok to see it there.
/end translation

However, most worries about it were summarized by Hojyn ( the power of the instoppable + inspiring combo ).

Anyway, let's playtest it.
However what is the inspiring supposed to represent?
1) fear ( like greater daemons )? In this case a lot of other creature should have it...  :O  :O
2) influence on genestealer? I don't know
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