I'm sending this out before Dec. as it's unlikely that I'll get in another game before 12/1. I'm planning on getting in a few more games with lists without Mycetic Swarms (to test the special rules changes a bit more) before I begin to test Planetary Assault.

Changes to 0.1.1 are listed below:

Tunneler was further clarified and the stipulation that all tunnelers (from the same formation) have to be within 15cm of the entry point was added.

Planetary Assault (the Phase III "rain of spores") has been added. I tried to keep it simple, while at the same time achieve the effect described in the fluff. This will probably be the most difficult thing to test/evaluate.

Tournament Objectives and Victory Conditions have been removed and some of their aspects have been folded into Synapse Swarms. Effectively this means that Synapse Swarm Brood creatures can contest/control objectives so long as synapse is alive, and the 'nid BTS special rule is gone (BTS is just regular BTS).

The list structure has been moved to the Ork model. This was done to give the fixed swarms back some diversity (via a la carte puchasing) and to remove the onus of creating a legal list from the player (via no more checking the synapse/independent point totals). Core units for the swarms are based on sprue contents. For a la carte purchases I rounded points up in most cases.

The Bio-arty swarm has been added.

The Harridan swarm can now be medium and large sized.

The Ravener swarm is now the Trygon swarm due to availability of Raveners.

Hive Fleet Onachus v.0.2.1

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I thought I'd post a first reaction. The mycetic spore idea looks fun in principle, but with a few tweaks. Paying 250 points for a unit that might not even show up sounds a little bit harsh to me, especially considering this is about the only way to use Carnifexes in this list. In the 9.2.1 structure, you can use Carnifexes with Tyrants to garrison an assault formation. This mitigates their low speed.

Just an idea, but have you considered

Turn 1: 5+
Turn 2: 3+
Turn 3: 1+

It would give you roughly the same distribution, but with every unit on the table by turn 3. Another idea would be...

Turn 1: 5+
Turn 2: 3+
Turn 3: 2+
Turn 4: 1+

This would give the turn 4 reinforcements the I-rolled-so-badly-I-deserved-it stamp of approval from me.

If the mycetic spores are treated like this because of some notion of it being a deterrant to teleporting large formations of nids, you could increase the cost depending on the swarm size instead. At least +25 for M and L formations respectively perhaps.

Other than that, I do have concerns that there are so many rules changes to the Tyranid special rules. I find it disconcerting, and I think it will lead to confusion in the end (irregardless of the clarity they bring to this list).

Anyway, I appreciate your work, your painting, and your battle reports.

Our gaming group is all about Warhammer Fantasy Battle for the rest of this year. I have a monthly Epic gaming group forming for next year, though, and I do have a Nid army, so I can give the list a spin facing at least Marines, Guards, Orks and Necrons.

/Fredmans

While the chances of not showing up are something like 83/67/50/33/17% when looking at a single roll, you have to take into account the chance of failure from previous die rolls for the averages. Those work out to something more like 83/56/28/9/2%.

Granted the concern that a swarm might not appear is still valid (9 and 2% for the 4th and 5th turn respectively), but it needs to be weighted against the concern of dropping a fresh swarm on the board late in the game where it can make an assault. Even with the 45cm opponent move, with the 15cm deployment radius a 'nid player can still put bugs within assault range of a formation, and with a good scatter roll they might be able to get most of the formation into an assault.

Those were my thoughts when coming up with it. It needs to be tested though. The playtests will determine if the rolls will be tweaked or the points adjusted, etc, so playtests are very welcome.

Re: the Carnifex, you can still get them in a regular swarm. Everything in the mycetic swarm is available to the regular swarm. It's only the bigger bugs I dropped from the mycetic swarm.

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I'm not sure such a rule is needed at all.

What would you do to represent Mycetic Swarms?

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Squats 2019-10-17

planetfall.

Impressions based on a quick scan of the document:

- Far too many special rules for my taste.

- The list is very popcorny (20 activations is possible, meaning you could probably make a very highly effective 15 activation army).

- The Planetary Assault rule is highly unreliable, highly random (In a game that's supposed to be about tactics), and essentially duplicates an already existing mechanic (Planetfall) except in a much less tactically complex manner. I suggest scrapping this rule and just using Spacecraft/Planetfall.

- Plus some other stuff about stat and points costs changes upsetting the balance of the Tyranid army list...


Overall, this list represents a step backwards from the NetEA list, rather than a step forwards, IMO.

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When we were playing the Phase III list with planetfall the biggest concerns/reservations was it didn't simulate a rain of spores so much as a planned attack.

Play-wise, dropping right in someone's face made for a lot of one-turn games that wasn't very challenging for the bugs.

@E&C

SM/IG/O/E can have 20/19/24/24 activation armies so I don't buy that it's a popcorn army based on that argument alone. If the playtests show something to be too cheap we'll up the cost.

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The light "rain of spores" is represented by spawning, planetfalling represents a heavier, more focused force.

Also, make the spacecraft slow and steady and you're not looking at a one turn game.

S&S would just make for a two turn game. The enemy would spend turn one marching, turn 2 overwatching, the bugs would land and assault on turn 3 and the game would begin.

I'm not married to the planetary assault but I do want to test it. You guys can tear the list apart all you want but I'm more interested in how the list is played/fought against on the table.

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I'm not sure the rule will work either, but I'd like to see it in action first. I do feel that planetfall is completely wrong for the Tyranids landing. Chroma had this in his Phase III list and it was tremendously overpowered, not to mention feeling wrong for the Tyranids.

The bugs don't have guidance systems to tactically place their falling warriors in the precise locations on the battlefield. Tyranids don't think about battles in that way. They have arrived with the sole purpose of devouring a planet, so every time they arrive it is with that one goal: Lunch!

The arrival is a risky matter because you may end up in the midst of a battle hardened group of Space Marines or in a corn field. As such, the goal is to try to achieve a certain amount of randomness to the drop without making the mechanic clunky. I am wondering if a coordinate chart would work to that end where you can make a simple roll to randomly pick an outcome (aka drop coords) for each formation. That kind of thing would be easy with 10 sided dice, but alas we're stuck with 6-sided.

EDIT - actually, I wondder now if it would be fine. A 3d6 roll for latitude and a 2d6 roll for longitude. So the chart would be a 16 by 11 grid; combine that with a scatter and you could make it a truly random arrival.

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I gave a coordinate system some thought too but what I came up with tied it to a 6x4 table. When I posted it 12/18 months ago the reaction was "too many dice rolls", hence why I went with PA. I still think it could work, it's just a matter of finding what works for the most people.

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I plan to playtest this list as much as possible as I see it as a step in the right direction for tyranids. Reverting to classic tyranid units and making the hive mind rules less extreme are both changes that I see as positive. If it is thoroughly playtested and the points costs are sorted then this will be my tyranid list of choice. Awesome job Dave!

I agree with E&C on these points. I haven't looked at the planetfall yet.

Could you post some lists that you think would be open to popcorn abuse?

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