Intentional. A short-ranged, one-shot weapon isn't worth keeping track of; it's part of the FF stat. [EDIT] which should probably be 4+...



Nope, chose not to. It doesn't add anything new or interesting, unlike the other new units that I did add. I upped the FF stat on biovores to possibly represent some pyrovores mixed in with them.

Well it would have adden a creature with FF Ignore Cover and/or Ignore Cover shooting. Thats new for Tyranids.

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Though they look superficially a bit similar you would think Pyrovores would be elsewhere on the battlefield doing different things - one is angry and likes wandering around eating dead things and has a short ranged flame attack, while the other sits back and fires artillery.

A 15cm and/or FF ignore cover attack would be new and different for the tyranids, I say add them in.

I don't see them as interesting enough to be worthwhile adding. They weapon they have is basically a heavy flamer, so they'd either be rubbish and never used or so cheap that they get spammed.

I don't do ignore cover FF, as it's messy, gamey and almost nothing official uses it.

Note that I also didn't add the mawloc, as I also feel it adds nothing new.

Mawloc and basic Trygon are pretty similar though. The Mawloc is slower, worth in CC, can't be a Synapse (no Mawloc Prime) but perhabs would have some First Strike abiliy due to it's more aggressive tunneling ability.
But anyway stats for Mawloc and pyrovore could look something like this:

Tyranid Mawloc
Type Speed Armour CloseCombat Firefight
War Engine 20cm 3+ 3+ -
Weapon Range Firepower Notes
Claws and Teeth (base contact) -

Damage Capacity 2. Critical Hit Effect: The Mawloc collapses, dead.

Notes: Burrower, First Strike..

Tyranid Pyrovore
Type Speed Armour CloseCombat Firefight
Infantry 15cm 5+ 4+ 4+
Weapon Range Firepower Notes
Flamespurt 15cm AP4+ Ignore Cover

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I'm not sure how your system works, BL, but is that the stats for a single Pyrovore, or, as infantry, a stand of 3-7 Pyrovores?

Hmm ok. I assumed the old Light Vehicle stats and just modified the Biovores stats from the Leviathan list. But Leviathan list has Biovores as Infantry which assumes 3 Bio-/Pyrovores per base.

So more appropiate stats would be this (and i suggest tripeling the Biovores shots too if they remain Infantry):

Tyranid Pyrovore
Type Speed Armour CloseCombat Firefight
Infantry 15cm 5+ 4+ 4+
Weapon Range Firepower Notes
3 x Flamespurt 15cm AP4+ Ignore Cover

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It's not a good idea to copy W40k stats too directly... what works for epic is more important. 3 Heavy Flamer equivalent shots seems OTT but perhaps they could be combined into a single AP2+ attack?

I agree that a Mawloc is similar enough to a Trygon that there's no point in separate profiles for them in epic (same really with a base of Venomthropes and a single Malanthrope) but I'd like to have stats for Pyrovores - preferably in the list even if you're not a fan of them yourself (others and W40k tyranids players may be) but if necessary then in a 'collectors model' section.

As regards the Tyranid Warrior stats and armour I really think you need to specify how many Warriors the profile will be based on - will it 3 or 5? Will you actually be able to fit 5 truescale Tyranid Warrior models onto an epic base?

The Ogryn stats assume 5 per base to get their 3+ save but if Tyranid Warriors will only be 3 per base (as things like Crisis Suits are) then IMO it's completely inappropriate for them to have a 3+ save.

I'm assuming 3 per base for all the big infantry, and honestly I assume the same for all big infantry in all lists, including Ogryns. A direct translation of the stats for 3 warriors would get you a 3+ save; that's 9 T4 wounds with a 4+ save. 5 Marines in 40k would need 30 bolter hits to kill them, 3 Warriors would need 36 hits. 3 warriors are therefore tougher than 5 marines, so a unit of them in epic should have a better save, especially when you consider that the unit could have more than 3 warriors in it. Like all epic infantry, it's not fixed; I'm pretty certain you could get 5 truescale warriors on a base if you really wanted, as truescale for nids is actually smaller than the existing models in most cases.

I'm not trippling the stats of the units with multiple weapons, that's how we ended up with nonsense obliterator stats. see fire dragons and dark reapers for an example of what happens when every model on the base has a ranged weapon. I may up some of the stats, though in most cases that'll just cause balance issues, since being infantry is already better than being LV.

I'll consider the pyrovore, but the mawloc is a definite no; it's nothing but clutter. As Glyn says, the Venomthrope would be almost identical to the malanthrope.

The Dark Reaper/Fire Dragons are a valid statement. In the WhES the Dark reaper's Eldar Missile Launcher have only AP6+ but the base of Dark Reapers (3-5 models on the base) has 2 x AP5+.

So giving Infantry Pyrovores 2 x AP3+ is just fine (and Infantry Biovores 2 x AP4+/AT5+ Disrupt, Indirect Fire).

If not including Mawlocs and Venomthropes i would put them in an collectors section and state that they could be used as stand-ins for Trygons and Malanthropes respectively.

Venomthrope stats:

Tyranid Venomthrope
Type Speed Armour CloseCombat Firefight
Infantry 15cm 4+ 3+ 6+
Weapon Range Firepower Notes
Lash Wips (base contact) Extra Attack (+1), First-Strike
Toxic Miasma (15cm) Small Arms

Notes: Jump Packs.

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I might include a "counts-as" list, but I have no current plans for a "collectors" section.

My original plan was simply to mention the similar units in the fluff text for their counts-as, but I've not done that yet.

I've put the other missing creatures into the Jormangandr list a few topics down. There is a line between clutter and useful additions. Personally I can only see the case for not including the Mawloc and Venomthrope, the Pyrovore and an ignore cover FF/ranged attack is useful. Having said that I've got the Venomthrope with a cover save granting ability and 1st Strike Mawlocs. It's down to personal preference.

IMHO a cover-save-granting ability is much to micro-scale for epic; if you're going to do that then you might as well give the Harpy a special rule about being able to CC skimmers because that's what their background text says they do.

Keep special rules to the absolute minimum.

Fair point. I've gone down the route of getting all the creatures in (at the moment) even if that requires application of an existing rule in a different way (Venomthrope rule will effectively be it acts as an AV for granting cover to Inf (currently to LV's and AV's as well but that probably needs chopping) and it ties into some of the Bio-Titan upgrades in the Bio-Titan list.

Understandable, but that's not what I'm trying to do with this list. This is about crafting a modern-style interpretation of a typical gribbly horde, not including everything. Anything that doesn't have a unique role isn't going in, unless it's really iconic.