The Norn Queen's Report |
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ragnarok
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Post subject: The Norn Queen's Report  Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 1:37 pm |
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Location: Reading, England
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I'm going to go against the flow on the ravener issue and say that their stats should be almost identical to those of warriors, or even with better FF.
I know it is 40K referance, but they are anything from 3 to 6 tiomes the cost of gaunts and have sthe stats of an upgraded warrior.
Not only that, but they are the only creature in the whole codex that can that three weapons.
They have 2 sets of close combat weapons and the ability to take a thorax mounted ranged weapon symbiote.
I think the main problem with raveners is that they are boarderline uncommon brood creatures.
One way to compensate for this and stop people taking raveners as their common brood creatures, could be to say that you can only take so many per thousand points as common trops, any more count as uncommon.
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wraeththu
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Post subject: The Norn Queen's Report Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:18 pm |
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| Quote (ragnarok @ 11 Feb. 2006 (07:37)) | I'm going to go against the flow on the ravener issue and say that their stats should be almost identical to those of warriors, or even with better FF.
I think the main problem with raveners is that they are boarderline uncommon brood creatures.
One way to compensate for this and stop people taking raveners as their common brood creatures, could be to say that you can only take so many per thousand points as common trops, any more count as uncommon. |
I totally agree! ?Thus my comment earlier about Raveners being the elite of the common broods. ?Raveners are basically modified tyranid warriors so they should be better than gaunts.
-Audrey
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Chroma
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Post subject: The Norn Queen's Report Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:40 pm |
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Location: Montréal, QC, Canada
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| Quote (wraeththu @ 11 Feb. 2006 (16:18)) | I totally agree! ?Thus my comment earlier about Raveners being the elite of the common broods. ?Raveners are basically modified tyranid warriors so they should be better than gaunts.
-Audrey |
Not to keep beating on this horse, but I believe making Raveners LVs also helps balance them, as they become much more vulnerable, allowing them to be "cheaper". They *are* the "elite" of the Common broods, and are borderline "Uncommon" in ability.
The text in the 'Nid codex specifically states that they are often targetted with heavy weapons just to eliminate the major threat they pose.
As to point values: I've long time been of the mind that all Brood creatures should have point values that are in 15 point increments, and that each multiple of 15 would be its spawning cost.
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Jaldon
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Post subject: The Norn Queen's Report Posted: Sun Feb 12, 2006 12:25 am |
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Location: Utah, pick a Pacific Island the other half of the year.
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Ravener
Type Speed Armour Close Combat Firefight
Infantry 20cm 4+ 3+ 5+
Weapons: Deathspitter and Scything Talons
Weapon Range Firepower
Deathspitter (15cms) Small Arms
Scything Talons (Base Contact) Assault Weapons
Notes: None. Brood Creature.
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Actually it is these stats that would make it cost around 30pts and more difficult to field.
It would seem, and this is a good thing, that most issues are revolving around the Carnifex and the Ravener. Probably in the end they are going to go back up to 25pts, when we settle on stats, but that isn't really going to be a problem.
I do agree that they are borderline uncommon in many ways, and the elite of the brood creatures, the real question is going to be how do we want it reflected in Epic. Which IS very different then WH40k in effect.
I still believe we need to keep the cost for them down, and I do feel 25pts is acceptable, then it only becomes what stats fit both its elite status and the points cieling?
More later............
Thanks All
Jaldon 
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ragnarok
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Post subject: The Norn Queen's Report Posted: Sun Feb 12, 2006 3:26 pm |
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I'm wondering, has anyone feilded a ravener heavy army?
I know that the worry is that making them expensive and brood could result in elite looking nid armies, but have such a thing beentried?
One of the nids main advantages is the mass of cheep expendible troops we have, which can be spawned back if needed. Taking fewer, armoured, raveners moves away from this and opens the swarms up to concenrated firepower which, even if it doesn't strip away the shield, means that the warriors leading the brood are more likely to be allocated hits, and thus die.
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nealhunt
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Post subject: The Norn Queen's Report Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 6:02 pm |
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I've faced a Ravener-heavy army many times, but that was a couple list versions ago. I'd say they averaged 50+% of the total common brood points.
At that time, it worked very well but they had a 4+ save. A Vituperator (DC5 at the time) loaded with 8 Raveners was extremely nasty. They were also great for leading a horde of Termagants. The Raveners would lead and guard the swarm with their armor saves. The Raveners would engage and the Termagants would support with FF. Even if the Raveners couldn't reach base contact, they did okay just by using sheer numbers and the +2 BM mod.
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asaura
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Post subject: The Norn Queen's Report Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 10:24 pm |
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| Quote (Hena @ 14 Feb. 2006 (18:39)) | | I would need it for my game on thursday. |
 For the record, I'm going to use the latest Tau List, 4.3.3. It's here.
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Jaldon
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Post subject: The Norn Queen's Report Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 3:09 am |
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v6.22 is up, and probably full of holes 
Please rip it up and let me know what you all think.
Thanks All
Jaldon
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Brave sir Robin, when danger reared its ugly head he bravely turned his tail and fled, Brave sir Robin.
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ObiWan
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Post subject: The Norn Queen's Report Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2006 12:20 am |
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OK, about the AA in the list (which I appear to be a heavy supporter, maybe it's the guys I play against that make me be worried about it) I agree that the Zoans being cheaper are easier to field, even if they were nerfed a point in the Warp Blast.
About the example you gave on the different types of planes, just ask any F-16 pilot if they would like to crash against an eagle or get one sucked by their jet intake
Now gargoyles are larger, and even if they don't try to actively ram the planes, they flock, so planes passing by will get some nasty effect.
Maybe aircraft getting a BM if they attack a formation that has 2 or more gargoyle stands? It would represent the pilot avoiding the gargoyles or getting a bunch of non critical but additive hits on his plane; just a thought.
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