I've played 5 games with them now and my opponent's gotten BTS everytime.

They don't get the -1 for being in contact with an AV, and if I do that with my gaunts to give them some cover my opponent has an easier time hitting the warriors as they can just ignore the stuff in cover.

Mixed formations are well and good but the "horde of lesser creatures" army that we were aiming for before 9.2, this is not. I'm fielding half of what I used to in termagants and hormagaunts now.

On BL's post, I think heavy infantry would fill a hole in the EA special rules. However, I don't see it as an overly large hole to begin with.

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with cover, I was more implying Cover Saves- which vehicles miss out on. Not a big deal for decent armour LV, but poor armour LV hurt.

I'm also aware the Nid list adds a bunch of special rules to compensate for the downsides of LV (namely, ignoring terrain). My statement was Light Vehicles in general (with an emphasis on Nids), as putting LV in you Guard, Orks, etc must be carefully considered as it makes the unit incredibly weak.

Mixed formations are well and good but the "horde of lesser creatures" army that we were aiming for before 9.2, this is not. I'm fielding half of what I used to in termagants and hormagaunts now.

Prior to 9.2, my opponents almost *always* got BTS, since it was an obvious way to hamstring the Bugs, so I'm not seeing that much of a difference; in fact, I've had opponents *not* get it now, because the Synapses have been protected by bulked other creatures.

They don't get the -1 for being in contact with an AV, and if I do that with my gaunts to give them some cover my opponent has an easier time hitting the warriors as they can just ignore the stuff in cover.

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I wish the LV rule had some compensation rather than just being the ginger-haired-step-child of the unit types.

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Really? In the all the games I played against Dave's bugs, I got BTS twice, maybe three times tops.

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The compensation should come in other stats rather than in the LV rule.  Some LVs are supposed to have higher armor values to compensate for their vulnerability.  In fact, at one point in development, JJ went through and added +1 to most of them.  The rest should be cheaper by points.

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This came up a while ago. While a Heavy Infantry designation would be ideal, rewriting and balancing every list in existance is not something to take lightly (I don't think there are any lists that don't have at least one unit that could/should be classed as HI). The Nid LV and special rules gets close enough that HI isn't needed for them.

The current philosophy in 9.2.1 is take more warriors or raveners. Change the Nid LV's to a new HI designation and the new philosophy would be take more warriors or raveners.

As a distilation of the topic, yes a HI designation would be ideal if you want to add it in but whether big Nid's are LV's or HI it doesn't make much difference and going back to INF doesn't seem very likely at this point (We need a reason to take raveners anyway).

Has the sacred tome of Epic Armageddon received core rule additions before?

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Since they represent "heavy infantry", the Tyranid modelling section specifies that they can be represented by 1-3 models per base, with "2" being the basis of their stats.

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Well Farseer is a new Special Ability only found in Epic: Swordwind. So a definitive yes to your question.

On topic: So as LV i have to base Tyranid Warriors as single models on a base?
Ogryns have one more Wound (3) than Tyranid Warriors but still have Toughness 4 and a 5ü save in 40k but still they are Infantry in Epic. All they get is a 3+ save.

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@Chroma: Ah. I didn't looked it up if the Tyranid basing rules are still in the current list

@Pulsar: My bad. Yes i meant Farsight

Oh just remembered: "Shoot the big ones" holds only true for Monstrous Creatures. Tyranid Warriors aren't Monstrous Creatures. Hive Tyrants and Carnifexes are.

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Farsight as far as I'm aware doesn't effect every army, it is an Eldar Special Ability, not a core rule change to the Epic Armageddon rulebook.

Nice try though.

The Overwatch for 2 Garrisons, was that not a core rule addition?

Tyranid Warriors are Infantry, they are based three to a base, as the rulebook states. LV are single models.

And they have legs, arms, they can crouch, jump, they can dodge attacks, make good use of cover. They are infantry all around, a difficult target fot AT weapons.

I have never played 40k, I don´t know that system, I don´t know what the wound or the toughness mean, but the comparison with Ogryns is ok.

cheers

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I have not played EA for very long however these seem like reasonable points to me.

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No where in EPIC:A, other than in the Phase IV document, does it say how Tyranid Warriors are based, they have been based "3 to a stand" in older versions of EPIC, while Lictors were based one to a stand... neither of those sets precedent for EPIC:A.

Tyranid Warriors are *much* bigger than Gaunts, they are bigger than Terminators, they may even be bigger than Ogryn (I don't have any Ogryn models to compare with).  Relative to the Broodlings that surround them, they make an obvious target, a fact that is mentioned time and again in the fluff as heavier weapons are brought to bear against "the big ones".

They've already got a 4+ save, which is close to the best cover save available, so that's a wash, they can move into all the kinds of cover infantry can, so they get that -1 to be hit.  Have you ever actually imagined three, or six, Tyranid Warriors "hiding" against a Carnifex?  That, to me implausible, situation would be occuring if two Tyranid-Warriors-as-Infantry were basing a Carnifex.

Tyranid Warriors *are* "heavy infantry", and the current combination of LV and the Tyranid rules reflects that fairly well.

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