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Rags KISS approach
ragnarok
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 11:41 am 
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(zombocom @ Feb. 14 2008,10:17)
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Hmmm. That could be a bit breakable, as you could spawn all the creatures in the formation nearest the enemy to do a big engagement.

I was more thinking along the lines of removing the +d3 for no near enemies, and maybe just increasing the basic spawning values, as well as stopping hyrodules being spawnable (it's stupid).

Well it should reduce the total number of creatures being spawned.

for example my 4K list I am going to be uses this week end has:

A Dominatrix
3 Tyrants
1 set of warriors
1 harridan

This give a total spawning of
dominatrix (2D3) + 3 tyrants (3 x 3) + 3 warriors (3 x 1) + harridan (2) = 2D3+14, average 17

compared to 4D3 (average 6) under my proposal.  Okay I can focus this spawning onto one or two swarms, but since I have done away with variable swarms you can't us the argumented spawning tactic.

I am going to put in a clause that says you can only spawn upto 4 units per swarm to further reduce the effectiveness.

I am also behind only allowing common broods to spawn, but that will involves a repricing of the uncomon.  So I wont do it for this experiemnt.

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zombocom
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 12:32 pm 
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It seems that with allt he required caveats (only common brood, max 4 per swarm etc) it's not going to be any simpler than the they current spawning system, which is the point of the excercise. I'm not keen on your spawning proposals.

Oh, and the average of 4d3 is 8, not 6.

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Lightbringer
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2008 12:55 pm 
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Re Spawning - I've only played the Markonz Variant list and have to say the spawning rules in this list are both simple to understand and not overpowering in the slightest.

Not being allowed to spawn when broken and having a base amount of only 1d3 per synapse creature (or group of warriors) means that when unbroken you will only get back a gaunt or 2 per swarm per turn.

In my recent report you'll see that virtually all my uncommon brood creatures remained unspawned.


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Dobbsy
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 12:33 am 
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Isn't that what I am doing?  


It is! :D But I was referring mainly to having one focussed approach rather than multiple. I didn't say I was happy another approach had been raised, just that I liked the idea of what you've done ;)

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Chroma
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 12:49 am 
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Well, I'm quite intrigued by the "KISS" variant... a KISS army, as it were...

Looking forward to seeing the .pdf, rag!

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ragnarok
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:42 am 
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Sorry  I know I promised to get it up yesterday, but I got distracted :p

I'll try to write it tonight.

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ragnarok
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2008 9:54 pm 
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Well I have writen up my Idea as a PDF.

If it isn't mentioned in a special rule then use the normal core rules for it (or I have forgotten it :D )

EDIT: forgot to give independant swarms ATSKNF

PDF has been updated




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Beardy fluffbag
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2008 10:43 pm 
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i think rags spauwning rules are fairly balanced as i had enough truoble dealing with the amount of fexes he was spawn see battle report nids v tech guard :O  :O

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ragnarok
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2008 11:15 pm 
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To be honest Beardy.  I wouldn't of been able to spawn soo mnay carnies in a single formation under any of the other rule sets.  However they would of allowed more spawning overall.  Which would you of prefered?

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Beardy fluffbag
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 12:57 am 
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the carnies as the infantry were so big!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Dobbsy
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 10:29 pm 
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So, Rags do you get the Xd3 spawning points each turn or across the whole battle? I only ask as it's not described. I assume each turn... but I thought I'd better ask.
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BlackLegion
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 10:34 pm 
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While i understand the design philosophy behind spawning (eg not only summoning creatures under the aegis if the hive mind which are still there but dropping larger creatures per spores) i don't like it and personally would limit spawning only to Infantry units.

The larger creature susually have such a high Leadership value in Wh40k that they can pretty much act onits own but without the overall view of the hives strategy a Synapse Creature would have.
Brood creatures on the other hand have such a low Leadership value that they will often fall prey to their instincitive behaviour (= go to ground, act aimlessly)) unless controlled directly by the hive mind.




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ragnarok
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2008 11:02 pm 
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(Dobbsy @ Feb. 17 2008,21:29)
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So, Rags do you get the Xd3 spawning points each turn or across the whole battle? I only ask as it's not described. I assume each turn... but I thought I'd better ask.

Yep it is xD3 per turn.

In the one battle I have played spo far I and my opponent didn't find it too powerful.

I was able to spawn back a couple of fexes just before an assault at the end of turn one, but it was at the expense of the other swarms gaining anything, which resulted in one swarm being broken.

the cap also meant that I wasn't able to heavily spawn in my main infantry swarm after it was mauled by a super heavy tank company.

So overall loses stayed higgher than reinforcements.

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ragnarok
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 7:50 pm 
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Well I have add three games with this iteration so far, and another planned for Wednesday..

I am generally happy with how the iteration works, though I will be removing fearless from carnies when I use it in future.

My only concerns with it are the implications of having ATSKNF when broken or when you lose an assault.  RThough it isn't that much of a boost and can be explained away by broken nids going to ground and being harder to shoot..

two of the battle reports are here

vs Tech guard

Vs titan legion

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Rags KISS approach
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 8:15 pm 
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though I will be removing fearless from carnies when I use it in future.


As I noted in your report, you've been using fearless under the 'old' rules, not the revised rules, so you may have had a skewed impression of it.

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