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Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=30605		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  scream [ Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
Hi,

another question that I can not find an answer by myself:

when do you declare a Warlock Titan power ? Does it depend on Titan Order ?
Author:  The Bissler [ Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
For Gold rules I would announce the power once the order phase is complete.
Author:  primarch [ Fri Dec 04, 2015 6:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
The Bissler wrote:
For Gold rules I would announce the power once the order phase is complete.


Hi!

Assuming its the power Bissler alludes too, he would be correct.

Primarch
Author:  csuia [ Thu Dec 10, 2015 10:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
Ok, we declare which Warlock Titan power we use at the end of order phase. But when we use it ? :)

Because each power is very different.
Doom : at the end of order phase ? When the Titan is activated at Movment phase ? When the titan is activated at Combat Phase ?
Witch Sight : at the end of order phase ? When the Titan is activated at Movment phase ?
Mind Shout : at the end of order phase ? At the beginning of Titan's move ? At the end of Titan's move ? When the titan is activated at Combat Phase ? At the final phase ?

Thanks for your responses
Author:  MagnusIlluminus [ Thu Dec 10, 2015 1:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
Declaring which one is being used is the same thing, in this case, as using it. As was said above, any of the three of those powers should happen at the end of the Orders Phase, and just after Initiative is determined.
Author:  scream [ Thu Dec 10, 2015 1:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
But Witch Sight power only lasts 1 Combat Phase (ie: FF or CC or Advance) so it's a bit "hard" to know if your warlock titan will still be there in advance fire segment.

Unless "Combat Phase" means a full turn ?
Author:  csuia [ Thu Dec 10, 2015 3:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
@Scream : for me, the Combat Phase means a full turn, yes.

@Magnus : Mind shout : all ennemy models within 25 cm must immediatly pass a morale check... Mind Shout is not interessing at the end of order phase but more at the end of the move of the titan.
Doom : at the end of order phase this power is very hard (but why not).

In fact, when the pyschic phase has been disappear (a good idea ^^), a new problem became : when the psychic powers is used ? For me, it is depend of the power. For example, the farseers have three powers. The mind blast must be used when the model is activated at the combat phase, Precognitive Direction must be used when the Farseer is activated at the movment phase and the Coercion must be used at the end of order phase.

For me :
Doom : when the titan is activated at Combat Phase
Witch Sight : at the end of order phase
Mind Shout : at any point of Titan's move

But it is my opinion and we (the frenchies ^^) want to know the rules ^^
Author:  MagnusIlluminus [ Fri Dec 11, 2015 2:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
Where are you getting that Witch Sight only lasts for a "combat phase"? There is no mention of that on the Warlock Titan Hit Location template. (Just realizes that I did not look at the Warlock Titan's description...) Ah, there it is. Right, I see what you mean now.

csuia wrote:
But it is my opinion and we (the frenchies ^^) want to know the rules ^^


Well, as far as "the rules" go, there is no set point at which they happen. The rules only say "4) A Warlock may use one of the powers below once per turn:" To me, this says that the power that you decide to use that turn can be used when and as you need it to be used, which makes the Warlock Titan very flexible in the use of it's powers.

Generally speaking, it is best to interpret rules as literally as possible, except with typos. A "Combat Phase" is a specific game turn that represents one of the three Phases when fighting happens during the turn, and is NOT the whole turn. Thus the phrase "Combat Phase" would mean either during First Fire, Close Combat, OR Advance fire Phases, but not all of them. The ability would not be usable during the Movement Phase, as it specifies a "Combat Phase". In any event, if the power is to be used during a specific Combat Phase, it should be declared as such at the beginning of that specific Phase.

Thus Witch Sight would be limited to one of the three actual Combat Phases, and declared at the beginning of it. Doom and Mind Shout could be activated when and as desired by the controller of the Titan.
Author:  scream [ Fri Dec 11, 2015 3:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
Thanks for your reply Magnus,

I think Warlock Titan description should be reworded and replacing "Combat Phase" by something clearer would be very helpful.

As according to its description, it says:
Quote:
"2) Orders are not placed for Warlock titans. They may be activated in any combat phase, but once activated must move within the restrictions of the orders given."


Unfortunately, Movement Phase is not a combat phase.....Combat Phase consists of "First Fire Segment, Close Combat Segment and Advance Segment" (page 32 NetEpic Gold Rulebook). So literally, we could even understand that the Warlock Titan could move during Movement Phase ::)

About the witch sight, my fault, I read "combat phase" as "combat phase segment", that's totally wrong, combat phase regroup the 3 segments (FF,CC,AF).
Author:  MagnusIlluminus [ Sat Dec 12, 2015 1:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
Argh, I made a typo in my post, and it changes the meaning. Where I said:
Quote:
A "Combat Phase" is a specific game turn that represents one of the three Phases when fighting happens during the turn, and is NOT the whole turn.
should instead say:
Quote:
A "Combat Phase" is a specific game term that represents one of the three Phases when fighting happens during the turn, and is NOT the whole turn.
It is just one word, but it changes the whole comment.


As to your note about the 'not placing orders' part, yeah, I missed that somehow. I agree that the description of that is just wrong. It is backwards, unless how it fires in Turn 1 determines how it moves in Turn 2, and that would just be silly. I just looked back at the TL rules for the Warlock Titan, and rereading the rules in the NetEpic Gold Eldar (with errata) book makes me think that the wording was supposed to be something like:
Quote:
2) Orders are not placed for Warlock titans. When they are activated in the Movement Phase the controlling player chooses their orders at that time. Once selected, the Warlock Titan must act within the restrictions of the orders given.
If this is what it is supposed to mean, then it needs to be changed to say that. The following change should probably be made as well.
Quote:
4) A Warlock may use one of the powers below once per turn, during the Phase appropriate to their orders:
Author:  scream [ Mon Dec 21, 2015 10:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
Thanks for your reply Magnus,

I did not received any "new reply notification" email so I've just discovered your reply...
Author:  MagnusIlluminus [ Wed Dec 23, 2015 1:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
No worries, things tend to be slow this time of year anyway.
Author:  The Bissler [ Wed Dec 23, 2015 8:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Warlock Titan Powers, when to use them ?
I think that psychic powers in general are probably an aspect of the rules that could do with some refinement.

Out of interest, can the likes of a Librarian use their psychic power if they engage an enemy unit in CC?
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