Deep strike is less scary for me.  They rarely drop exactly where they wanted to and more importantly have to come down in Compulsory so you get your whole movement phase to organise a response.  A 75cm Infiltrate on an unpinnable unit that can drop jump-troops anywhere along its subsequent 75cm movement is a bit too scary.  You cite the Harridan....and itand its Gargoyles are an awesomely scary unit to use as a precedent and I'd worry about something BETTER than it!  The Harridan can only move 25cm....so at the end of the first turn it can only get to where your Valkyries started !

Subjugators infiltrate?

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Fire bad, tree pretty - Buffy

It was just a thought for the Valkyries. I thought it would have made sense but maybe not so much in the mechanics of the game, no matter.

You mean Subjugators don't?.. Were we the only ones who played it this way? Back in the mists of time when the Slaanesh Knights and Scout Titans first came out John, our Chaos player convinced us that the Subjugator should be able to infiltrate... we have always played it that way and I guess I forgot it was a house rule.

Fluff from the original White Dwarf article. ...it is the Subjugator Scout Titans which race ahead of the army. It is the role of these swift war machines to suppress the enemy fire and allow the Fiends, Chaos Space Marines and other followers of Chaos to attack with minimal resistance. Loping along the flanks of the battlefield, the Subjugator uses its Psi-Pulse to pick off enemy artillery before it can fire...

We allowed Subjugators to always infiltrate 30cm (base move). They also used to be able to shoot one Psi shot in the Psychic Phase (Psychic Phase is long gone however so no free shot, thank goodness for infiltrate) and also be able to Charge 60cm into close combat that would give it the added benefit of a -2 to be hit with ranged attacks. Ah, the good ol' days when Slaanesh was king/queen and Eldar were very, very afraid. I had an Eldar player who's table was only 100cm wide, *sigh* I loved that table.

Although I have eight (4x Packs) of these monsters I was mostly on the receiving end of them. I didn't think infiltrate for Subjugators broke the game... Imperial Paladin Knights could kill Subjugators nicely as could Quake Cannons on Crusader/Castellan Knights. Eldar Jet Bikes were also a good defence, but maybe not so good now.

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My head is full of War...

[img]http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk120/Warhead40k/Tyranid%20Swarm/DSC02262.jpg[/img]

I never really rated then Slaanesh knights back when they were released.  I played Eldar a lot back then and they were relatively easy to score big points off.  The Slaanesh knight households are a great innovation so you could take the knights and still be aggressive with them.  I managed to make up 2 full companies + some extras.  If you go back through the threads in this section I think I posted a couple of battle reports using a Slaanesh army with the House Devine knights.  They did pretty well.

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Fire bad, tree pretty - Buffy

Yup, seen it, read it, loved it. I told you before Zap, those early BatReps especially the one you did with the Eldar Knights is what made me sign up on TacComm. I first spotted Warmaster Nices City Ruins on a different site. That lead me here and I dropped in and read the NetEpic BatReps and then signed up that night and as I recall got stuck into the communities ribs over Manticores and Whirlwinds. What a prat I made of myself.  

I'm not enamoured yet with the Devine Household. I remember I wasn't convinced that it was any different to paying separately for the units themselves with regards BP and VP. I don't like the idea of splitting up packs of scout titans but to be fair I haven't played it like this yet so should give it a try.

Yeah, knights can give out big points. Our solution was to drop the Questors, Hell Knights and Hell Scourge Packs by 50 points. We also had found an obscure reference on a Q+A that Eldar Titan Holofields automatically scatter Barrage Templates so we came up with +3cm to any rolled scatter for Eldar and Slaanesh Knights too, this was to represent the difficulty of targeting these units. We did all this at the start and they have played like this for years. It seems to work for us.

We had to come up with things like this because the internet support wasn't there like it is today... I didn't even have a computer back then so it wouldn't have mattered. I'm beginning to suggest to the group that we drop some houserules back to the official rules while still maintaining others.

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My head is full of War...

[img]http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk120/Warhead40k/Tyranid%20Swarm/DSC02262.jpg[/img]