taiaha wrote:
I like your idea for the carts, and all 4 have unique useful functions. However I agree with Steve that we might still need to tone them down a little.
On paper these options might look like a lot of firepower, but they are incredibly short ranged. One of the balancing rules is that with short ranged firepower you need that firepower to balance out, as you may miss turns being in range, need to double etc.
A 20cm move unit with 30cm weapons is going to have a tough time finding appropriate targets each turn.
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Here's one option - using your build as starting point:
Rad Bomb
Cost: 100pts
Rad Bomb: 60cm MW 2+ TK(D3) Single Shot.
Radiation Vents: EA +1 FF MW
I dont know how to cost this - a deathstrike has unlimited range and TK(d6) for 100pts. Maybe if this was slow-firing, rather than single shot? Though the EA(+1) FF MW is pretty good too.
i had forgotten about slow-firing, that's a good suggestion. 100pts seems about right as it's adding 1 DC and 1Void sheild (which get more powerful as they stack up).
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Siege Mortar
Cost: 100pts
Siege Mortar: 60cm BP1 MW
I dont think that it needs a FF/CC option - that could be what the other carts are for. (having assault EA and the MW BP makes it an auto-include. Without FF/CC EA, then I have to make a choice what I want my train to focus on). Guessing 100pts since it's only range 60 and no Indirect?
I'd like each cart to have some sort of CC/FF option. It might be auto include but you're only going to have one so we can live with it. The other option is to increase the basic engine to 4BP for 100 points (as per the artillery option below) and make this cart something more interesting
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Dragon
Cost: 75pts
30/(45?)cm 4 x AP4+ Ignore cover
Incendiary bombs: EA(+1) FF Ignore Cover
I suspect 60cm on a flamethrower might raise eyebrows... Also EA(+2) means i am definitely spamming these - if i take four I get 14 dice at FF4+.
Berzerker
Cost: 75pts
Each cart increases CC value by 1 up to a maximum of 2+
EA(+1) CC
AA Autocannon 45cm AP5+/AT6+/AA5+
- this seems a good choice at 75pts, but unlikely to take more than one since extra FF attacks on the other carts are more valuable.
So, lets looks at some builds.
First build is one Berzerker and 3 Dragon for an assault train.
500pts, DC6, 4 Void Shields. 12x AP4+ IC at 30cm, and the two Thunderers at 30cm, but only the 60cm 3BP MW beyond that (+ one crappy autocannon). 6DC + 4EA = 10 dice in assault assuming at least one enemy in base contact. I like this build, but is 12x AP4+ too much?
12xAP4+ is pretty crappy. It's 7 infantry hits at very short range. i can take two Thudd Gun units and deal 8 infantry hits at much longer range and indirect. Plus if this train is focusing on AP then it's not bringing much else to the table. The rest of the squat army is great at AP, and they need to War Engines to deal with tanks or titans.
Secondly you can build a train with one bezerker and three dragon cars NOW in 1.5 and get a better unit! (longer range on all the engine weapons, still 12xAP+) and it's a build that no-one seems to want totake.
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Second build - One Siege Mortar, 3 Rad bombs for a tank/WE-hunter
600pts, DC6, 4 Void Shields. 60cm 4 BP MW, 3x 60cm MW2+ TK(D3) Single Shot, 9 dice in firefight. That is probably comparable power with a Reaver Titan with similar loadout?
Still very sub par to a Cyclops! This cart can put out 3xD3 TK hits over the game. The Cyclops can do 4D6+4 at longer range. And costs 100 points less!
Finally with both these builds they will be taken apart in CC by anything dedicated, like terminators or other war engines. When fighting against any other 4+RA units, you need to have MW or TK in order to do anything.
Remember that as soon as something is in CC with the train, it can't use any of those FF buffs against it, nor do the void sheilds count.
We're aiming for a comparison with a Gargant. Take a moment to look it's rules
8DC with 4+RA and 4-6 powerfields is pretty tough. It has 8 CC or FF at 3+ which is far more than the Train's 6 at 5+CC or 4+FF.
With two sooperguns it has ranged at 60com 4BP MW, superior to the trains 60com 3BP MW, and then has a choice between a second TK(D3) attack either at 60cm or in close combat
That gargant is going to outshoot or outfight any of those Land Train builds.