Fellas, TacCom down and a spell, a long spell, to get to really read up on E40k.

Hm... These rules are good. Why where they so bedevilled?
I can see a few cases, Warhead showed some to (but please repeat them here!), but what the rest of us think?
To me they seem far more clear-cut than the current EA rules...

I played it twice when it came out. The rules I found being much more streamlined than the 2nd edition ruleset, played smoothly. Problem was, it is too streamlined. Feels like you could just throw some dice on a table where some minis happen to be standing around. The good parts have been incorporated into E:A which I am in the process of getting the hang of it. 2 games so far after dozens of Netepic games.

"Zero flavour" was the generally accepted problem with the rules.

Basically, it's the same as when 40K moved on from the disaster of second edition. I attribute it mostly to shock value. Epic went from the SM/TL horde of special rules for every little unit to the very streamlined E40K. People thought that was a terrible loss of flavor and feel. And like 2nd edition 40K, there is a substantial cult following that sticks with SM/TL in the form of NetEpic.

Personally, I thought E40K was a very good system and highly dynamic. It had a few exploitable bits but I thought it vastly better than SM/TL.

I played many many games of Epic40K a long time ago.

I find it to be a very good game, once you realize that it is designed to represent huge battles, and it is very abstract. One formation/detachment can be a regiment or even a division. Nothing to do with E:A (1 model=1 soldier/vehicle).


That´s what I think about SM/TL/NetEpic, no blast markers, no assaults, just lots of rules and throw dice. Well, I think Blast Markers are the best invention of history so I´m biased .

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Mechanics ... not bad, much better than SM2/TL IMO ... Epic : A is the best of the lot ... again IMO ... Unit Activation makes all the difference. We used it since SM1, I added it to the rules back then then. It took G/W a decade or so to see the light ... LOL !!!

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Legion 4 "Cry Havoc, and let slip the Dogs of War !" ... "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."

So if with more flavour and keeping unit activation and suppression (ie BM's) there's a general feeling it would work and be enjoyable?

lord bruno ~ Where's that "designed to represent huge battles" come from? With so much low-level TO&E I would say it's the opposite?

Personally, I think that E40k was an excellent game. My opinion is that GW made a classic mistake. They tried to change the general theme and philosophy of the game. Previous editions, and GW games in particular, draw on background and fluff and relatively high detail level (which is the reason for all of the special rules in 40K).

So, they were faced with the problem of trying to market a cut-down Epic game to existing players who wanted the details, and to players who wanted a more streamlined game but didnt look at Epic because of past editions.

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One of the good things about EA is that it keeps much of the streamlined play from E40k (alright, not quite all of it), while adding in a lot more individual weapon and unit flavour.

I am a new convert to Epic: Armageddon, and so my only exposure to E40K is through the supplements I have been collecting. If the level of print existed now, as opposed to what "used to be", how amazing would that be?

I will say, in defense of E:A, that I collected 5 or 6 rulesets of 6mm in my quest to learn more about the scale. I started playing them from the top, one at a time, starting with E:A since a friend had some experience with it.

Yea, lets just say that I havent made it to any of the other rulesets yet...

5 or 6?
Epic:A, netEpic, BattleTech, FWC, Wardogs, Dirtside2, SoW, Iron Cow... Which more are there?

If Battletech is in there, Heavy Gear Blitz probably should be. There's also probably a couple hundred WW1/2 Micro-Armour games out there that come with, or are easily convertible to 'sci-fi'. And to be fair, he didn't specify 'sci-fi' as a criteria.

Morgan Vening

Heavy Gear isnt 6mm. I think it used to be close though. I played that heavily back in the day, but Blitz just doesnt feel right to me.

The rules I found were:

Dirtside II
E:A
Seeds of War
Prophecy of War
FWC

Those are the ones that kept rising to the top on TMP's forums. I admit, I am curious about Wardogs but hate buying things sight-unseen (read: FWC). NetEpic never appealed to me, though I browsed it. Dunno about Iron Cow?

After E:A, I am most interested in DSII but need someone to play with me who knows how.

Thanks Kealios;

Future War Commander is worth a "read" for the pictures (Oh no mum, I read it because of the articles!) alone I'd say.

Seeds of War seem to have done to E40k what E40k should've done and E:A tried to do. (E:A suffer from the same problem as Flames of War, ie you know exactly what it takes to suppress a unit. It also handles suppression better than E:A, ie penalty if suppressed and not various hard to explain and execute "those can't shoot".)

Prophecy of War is a bit to general for my taste. But has some nice mechanics.

Dirtside 2 is the Mother and the Father. And the chit drawn damages are neat and offers a few thngs not otherwise possible.
There's however a bit of work to get forces for it, as you have to do them all yourself. Infantry are also mainly speedbumbs.

Iron Cow is neat but in the avarage group. But it has it's own universe (Jon's DS and Steve's IC share a common start of work there. And they both follow the same lines as OGRE does.)

Wardogs feel a bit to much like "I got to have such rules too".

HGB as well as CAV and MechWarrior are (an) other scale(s). And any rules set could be used for sci-fi. These here are however made for it.

Dirtside II has a dice conversion that I would use if I were to play it. However, the link I had for it isnt working so I cant show it to you

The reason I wont buy Wardogs is I did buy a M12 skirmish game and found it to be absolute rubbish. Oh well.