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6mm terrain suitable for Epic
TuffSkull	Post subject: 6mm terrain suitable for Epic Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2003 1:37 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2003 11:49 am Posts: 2830 Location: South East UK	Hi Guys, Decision made, I started fiddling with a 5000point Ork list last night ready for the New Year's painting project to begin. I wont be starting this project in any big way until the 21st January, as thats when my GF returns to Uni, but I may Fiddle a few bits before then (and I'm cheating anyway as I have a few bits already done!) I want to have 3 factions to give a good variety of painting. These will be a Blood Axe Faction (possibly with some looted Desert Ferrin Vehicles for character - I have some chimeras & Leman Russ left over anyway!), a Bad Moon Faction and last but by no means Least, The Speed Freaks Faction. All will be roughly equal in size at just under 1500points each, and the Gargant will fill the gap to make 5K. The List somewhat wrote itself. I started making a note of what units I wanted, and when I stopped to toal up how much I'd got so far, I'd almost filled the 5K! On Noticing I hadnt included any flyboyz, the addition of a few put me just over the target (dodgey maths withstanding). So the list currently stands at: Blood Axe Faction: Big Warband (4 Nobz, 12 Boyz, 4 Grotz) + 2 Nobz + 10 Battlewagons ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?770 points Stormboyz Warhorde (6 Stormboyz) ? ? ? ? ? ? ?150 + 6 x Kommandoz ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?150 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 300 points 'Uge Blitz Brigade (2 flakwagon, 10 Gunwagonz) 350 + 2 Gun Fortresses ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?270 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 620 points Blood Axe Total: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?1690points Bad Moonz Horde Big Warband (4Nobz, 12 Boyz, 4gretchin) ? ? ? ? ? ? 350 points Big Mekboy Gunz Mob ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 225 + 2 Oddboyz ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? +100 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 325 points Stompa Mob ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 225 + 2 Stompas ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?+150 + 4 Dreds ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?+140 + 5 killa Kanz ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? +125 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?640 points Bad Moonz Total: 1315 points Kult of Speed Flyboyz (6 Fighta Bomberz) ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 300 points Big KoS(5 Bike, 8 Buggies, 3 Skorchers) ? ? ? ?350 + 1 Flak Wagon ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?35 + Oddboy ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?50 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?435 points Big KoS ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 350 + Flak Wagon ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?35 + 8 Gunwagons ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?280 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?615 points Kult of Speed Total: 1350 points Gargant: ?650 points Army Total: 5005 points _________________ Cheers, Paul "TuffSkull" T. http://hobbybrush.com - My New Website, with thousands of painted Mini Pics :) http://hobbybrush.blogspot.com - My Hobby Blog TuffSkull's notepad- My Old Blog on Wargames Wiki.
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TuffSkull	Post subject: 6mm terrain suitable for Epic Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2003 1:39 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2003 11:49 am Posts: 2830 Location: South East UK	I can come up with Ork Models for pretty much anything (with the worrying exception of Fighta Bombers it seems...), so let me know what you'd keep, change or alter in this list as I've not playtested Orks myself yet so am looking for advice! many thanks for your input, I'll start amassing the troops..... _________________ Cheers, Paul "TuffSkull" T. http://hobbybrush.com - My New Website, with thousands of painted Mini Pics :) http://hobbybrush.blogspot.com - My Hobby Blog TuffSkull's notepad- My Old Blog on Wargames Wiki.
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vanvlak	Post subject: 6mm terrain suitable for Epic Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2003 6:11 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2003 7:52 am Posts: 10348 Location: Malta	What - no Landa?     _________________ Back from oblivion (again)?
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Chris	Post subject: 6mm terrain suitable for Epic Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2003 6:38 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2003 6:42 pm Posts: 2412	Quote (vanvlak @ 29 2003 Dec.,17:11) What - no Landa? ? ? I think that is due to the lack of a model... Fighta bombers shouldn't be a problem Tuff, they will be avaliable when you start this project. Cheers Chris _________________ Chris
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nealhunt	Post subject: 6mm terrain suitable for Epic Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2003 7:31 pm
Purestrain Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 10:52 pm Posts: 9617 Location: Nashville, TN, USA	Generally speaking, it looks good, but the formations are really large all across the board.  You would probably do better splitting a few of them up to give you a bit more tactical flexibility. >> Big Warband (4 Nobz, 12 Boyz, 4 Grotz) + 2 Nobz + 10 Battlewagons                                          770 points For example, this is really big.  It could easily function as 2 mechanized infantry units for only slighly more points.  Solid and well-rounded either way. >> Stormboyz Warhorde (6 Stormboyz)              150 + 6 x Kommandoz                                                150 You Kommandoz will slow down your Stormboyz.  I would recommend all Stormboyz, or dethkoptaz in order to keep your speed up.  As long as you are 50% or greater on Stormboyz, the formation will still be able to garrison. It's rather unfortunate, but Kommandoz don't have much place in the army, tactically speaking.  They would probably do better in the warband, as you could have them ride along to the assault, and they they can bypass ZoC when charging, allowing more units in base-to-base. >> 'Uge Blitz Brigade (2 flakwagon, 10 Gunwagonz) + 2 Gun Fortresses Again, this could be 2 formations.  Perhaps a Big brigade and a basic w/ Fortresses.  My personal preference for an armor formation is basic BB (1 flak, 2 gunwagon, 1 oddboy wagon), and a gunfortress for 335 points. >> Big Mekboy Gunz Mob                                 225 + 2 Oddboyz                                                     +100 I would strongly recommend picking up all the spare nobz.  Gunz don't count for mob up, so you really need the help on removing BMs.  Also, having a few extra stands to bump it to a Uge mob might be fun (I like the gunz). >> Stompa Mob                                           225 + 2 Stompas                                                  +150 + 4 Dreds                                                      +140 + 5 killa Kanz                                                 +125 I would recommend taking fewer kans, dreads and stompas and take a supastompa for about the same points.  Same firepower as a gargant for much lower price. >> Bad Moonz Total: 1315 points Never enough bad moonz! >> Big KoS(5 Bike, 8 Buggies, 3 Skorchers)        350 + 1 Flak Wagon                                                  35 + Oddboy                                                          50 The oddboy has nothing to upgrade.  You can't add it to a flakwagon or any of the KoS units.  If you want flak shots and an oddboy, you will need to take a flakwagon and a gunwagon w/ the upgrade. I've found KoS do better when they are single-purpose formations.  This is a solid, well-rounded formation but you have other well-rounded formations.  I would recommend making the formation all bikes, or all LVs.  If you want a shooty formation, a mix of mostly buggies, with a few skorchas and the wagonz.  If you want an assault formation, use mostly bikes with a few skorchas, but the mix of bikes and LVs may come back to haunt you. >> Big KoS                                                   350 + Flak Wagon                                                      35 + 8 Gunwagons                                                  280 Similar to above.  If you want an armor formation, use a straight BB, as it will no doubt end up cheaper.  If you really want a mix, double check whether it's cheaper this way, or with a BB and upgrades (You're probably right, but I have no idea off the top of my head). This would also work well as separates - Big Kos and Big BB. Hope that helps. _________________ Neal
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TuffSkull

Post subject: 6mm terrain suitable for Epic Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2003 2:00 pm

Brood Brother Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2003 11:49 am Posts: 2830 Location: South East UK

Quote (nealhunt @ 29 2003 Dec.,18:31) Generally speaking, it looks good, but the formations are really large all across the board. ?You would probably do better splitting a few of them up to give you a bit more tactical flexibility. As ever, great points Neal - Thanks! As ever, I followed what "felt" right in character when putting the list together, which inevitably means its got some basic gaming flaws - such as limited activations because I went for all Big formations. Thats why I post here - great "reality check"   >> Big Warband (4 Nobz, 12 Boyz, 4 Grotz) + 2 Nobz + 10 Battlewagons ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?770 points For example, this is really big. ?It could easily function as 2 mechanized infantry units for only slighly more points. ?Solid and well-rounded either way. It is rather Huge........ OK, I guess Blood Axe's can operate in smaller units better than my other two factions, so if I'm splitting something up, I'll split these guys into two. Makes sense I guess. >> Stormboyz Warhorde (6 Stormboyz) ? ? ? ? ? ? ?150 + 6 x Kommandoz ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?150 You Kommandoz will slow down your Stormboyz. ?I would recommend all Stormboyz, or dethkoptaz in order to keep your speed up. ?As long as you are 50% or greater on Stormboyz, the formation will still be able to garrison. It's rather unfortunate, but Kommandoz don't have much place in the army, tactically speaking. ?They would probably do better in the warband, as you could have them ride along to the assault, and they they can bypass ZoC when charging, allowing more units in base-to-base.

I have to say that the Kommandoes seemed out of place, but I wanted some in my army & thought If I put them in some genius might inform me of a good use for them.
However, I can see that if I add them to one of the (now half sized) warbands, I'm going to run out of transport. If I add the transport needed, I'm back to a massive unit again & as you said, some flexibility is very much required.

What do you reckon to adding 4 to one warband with 6 of the battlewagons & having the other as just a simple warband with 6 battlewagons?

That keeps them both small, but slightly varied. However, I have dropped 2 Nobz and 2 Kommandoz. The lost units should help cover the extra cost of splitting formations. Will they be missed?


>> 'Uge Blitz Brigade (2 flakwagon, 10 Gunwagonz)
+ 2 Gun Fortresses

Again, this could be 2 formations. ?Perhaps a Big brigade and a basic w/ Fortresses. ?My personal preference for an armor formation is basic BB (1 flak, 2 gunwagon, 1 oddboy wagon), and a gunfortress for 335 points.


Again, point well taken. With more time to think, I'm liking the idea of having one big brigade with a fortress of Ork Nastyness, and one Ordinary brigade made of looted vehicles with a Fortress based on an Imperial Super heavy. Defies the "speed paint" logic somewhat, but even if I add the detailing at a later date, the Unit will be split with this in mind.

>> Big Mekboy Gunz Mob ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 225
+ 2 Oddboyz ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? +100

I would strongly recommend picking up all the spare nobz. ?Gunz don't count for mob up, so you really need the help on removing BMs. ?Also, having a few extra stands to bump it to a Uge mob might be fun (I like the gunz).

I think it wil stay the size it is (big Not 'Uge) mainly becuase I dont want a great deal of repeats in the army - 10 strong already gives me some repeated models if I go to 15 it will be really noticable. Pure aethstetics, but thats just me
As for the Nobz, I'll play them once without but have them waiting in the wings as what you says makes a lot of sense.

>> Stompa Mob ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 225
+ 2 Stompas ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?+150
+ 4 Dreds ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?+140
+ 5 killa Kanz ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? +125

I would recommend taking fewer kans, dreads and stompas and take a supastompa for about the same points. ?Same firepower as a gargant for much lower price.


Main thing here is lack of a model. The second I read the army lists I decided to add Dethkoptas, Supastompas & landas to my force, but they wont be in the first wave - they'll come as reinforcements when the models are released.


>> Big KoS(5 Bike, 8 Buggies, 3 Skorchers) ? ? ? ?350
+ 1 Flak Wagon ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?35
+ Oddboy ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?50

The oddboy has nothing to upgrade. ?You can't add it to a flakwagon or any of the KoS units. ?If you want flak shots and an oddboy, you will need to take a flakwagon and a gunwagon w/ the upgrade.

I have to admit that I thought the Oddboy was completely out of place with what is essentially a fast moving assault force, but I happen to have a speed freaks one pre-painted so put it in. Adding that to the fact that I missed off anything for him to be upgrading, I'll remove him from the list.


I've found KoS do better when they are single-purpose formations. ?This is a solid, well-rounded formation but you have other well-rounded formations. ?I would recommend making the formation all bikes, or all LVs. ?If you want a shooty formation, a mix of mostly buggies, with a few skorchas and the wagonz. ?If you want an assault formation, use mostly bikes with a few skorchas, but the mix of bikes and LVs may come back to haunt you.

Oooooo..... Ok, I'll take your advice on that one and make one of the KoS's 12 Bikes and 4 Skorchas & the other can take up the buggies, gun wagons, flak & 2 remaining Skorchas (once I've checked price comparisons with a BB). I could add more skorchas, but will trial it first.


This would also work well as separates - Big Kos and Big BB.


And without having the lists here to check, I wouldnt mind betting that that would work outcheaper on points. I'll definitely look it up.

Thanks mate, got a lot to think about there!