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Necrons 4.3
Ilushia
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 9:59 pm 
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I still support a change of Heavy Destroyers to 2x AP 6+/AT 4+, and the basic Eques formation going up to 400 points myself. But I seem to be in the minority.
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zombocom
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 10:52 pm 
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Ilushia: Under the previous version, when Heavy's were 2x AT4+ with no AP, they were still by far better than normal destroyers. Making them better by adding an AP would mean noone would ever take normal ones.

I'm not at all against the idea of charging extra for heavy destroyers. They should be more heavily armed than normal destroyers, so probably should cost more. Currently they cost the same and are less well armed which makes no sense at all.

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hiddenevil
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 1:03 am 
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i vote for the single shot AT 3+, that would work well for them, they will get more hits which is good since more AT is needed, but with a single shot over 2 they cant overkill with a bit of luck.

since hardly anyone is taking them in a combined formation of destroyers/heavy destroyers you can just make them both a formation of their own (assault eques for destroyers and support eques for heavy destroyers) and them just make the heavy destroyers formation cost more

that could work

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hiddenevil
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 1:06 am 
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i vote for the single shot AT 3+, that would work well for them, they will get more hits which is good since more AT is needed, but with a single shot over 2 they cant overkill with a bit of luck.

since hardly anyone is taking them in a combined formation of destroyers/heavy destroyers you can just make them both a formation of their own (assault eques for destroyers and support eques for heavy destroyers) and them just make the heavy destroyers formation cost more

that could work

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fbruntz
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 1:54 pm 
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(zombocom @ Nov. 30 2007,21:52)
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Ilushia: Under the previous version, when Heavy's were 2x AT4+ with no AP, they were still by far better than normal destroyers. Making them better by adding an AP would mean noone would ever take normal ones.

I don't agree on that point. HD were less polyvalent and weaker in FF (4+ vs 3+). In the V4.2, the HD were not better than the normal destroyers.
In the v4.3, they become out of price.

Some few questions, sorry if they have already be answered but I don't have the courage to read the 11 pages of the topic...  :blush:

Do Obelisks lose the "scout" competence?

I've read that the Nightbringer has gained the portal competence?!!!!  ??? Must be a mistake, hum?

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Ilushia
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:42 pm 
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I'm not sure how you can claim that Heavy Destroyers are too tank-killy with 2x AT 4+ really at 400 points for 6. That's roughly 66 points per hit. Leman Russ, by comparison, with the main gun firing at tanks average 1 hit per 1.2 Russ, or roughly 78 points per AT hit. But comparatively they gain Reinforced Armor, have -much- better range main guns, and much much better AP fire power.

The only reason I see that the Heavy Destroyers would be seen as 'too good' against tanks is because they're basically the ONLY AT unit in the list which doesn't depend on assaults to kill them. Much like the Deceiver seeing disproportionately larger amounts of play then the Nightbringer, and the Aeonic Orb seeing more play then the Abattoir it's not that they do better then other race's options, it's that they do better then THIS race's options. LOTS of stuff has AP 4+ shots, but very few things in the list have significant AT shots, so you see more of them then the regular Destroyers. Infact, on a per-point-cost basis the Obelisks are better AT firepower then the Heavy Destroyers, as they can also teleport, are fearless, have RA, and cost about 60 points per AT hit on average rolls (Assuming no doubles anyway). So I really can't see how the argument that 2x AT 4+ at 400 points for 6 is 'over powered' can hold water realistically. I'd add AP 6+ to represent the fact that every single one of them carries a heavy weapon, and with that many shots you're gonna gun down some infantry sooner or later. Comparatively they've got basically the equivalent of 3 lascannons per base, right now. That, and because it'd nicely make them mirrors of the regular Destroyers.

But I seem to be in the minority on feeling this way. So I'm not too worried about it to be honest (Heck, that change works AGAINST me to be honest, since my primary list is AMTL and it makes them better against tanks then they currently are! And my primary opponent plays Necrons!)
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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:45 pm 
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I think it's obvious now, that Heavy Destroyers should be:

A - Stronger in AT than they are now.

B - More expensive than normal destroyers.

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Ilushia
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:46 pm 
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I'm not sure why they should be more expensive then regular destroyers, other then filling a niche role in the list which other things can fill as well they're not strictly -better- then normal destroyers (Worse, actually, as they have FF 4+ instead of FF 3+, and no advantages other then better AT fire!)

Infact, to hear Moscovian talk of it I'd say that regular Destroyers should be more expensive as well! Considering a unit of 6 averages 6 hits on AP fire in a turn assumign an advance (Say out of a monolith), or 4 against guys in cover on an advance!
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Moscovian
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:08 pm 
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I've got a game with the Necrons coming soon and I will be playing the Destroyers and Heavy Destroyers to show you all why they are broken even as light vehicles.

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Chroma
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:14 pm 
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(Moscovian @ Dec. 04 2007,14:08)
QUOTE
I've got a game with the Necrons coming soon and I will be playing the Destroyers and Heavy Destroyers to show you all why they are broken even as light vehicles.

Are you playing against a "Core" army or another "Raiders" army?

We expect a *full* bat rep!   :D

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Moscovian
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:40 pm 
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I think it will be the IG, although we may go Minervans - I am not sure.

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Chroma
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:43 pm 
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(Moscovian @ Dec. 04 2007,14:40)
QUOTE
I think it will be the IG, although we may go Minervans - I am not sure.

Hey Moscovian!  If you want to "prove" that the Destroyers/Heavy Destroyers are broken, I highly recommend you fight against a "Core" army...

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Necrons 4.3
PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 3:37 am 
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What is the current Necron list?

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