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First Space Marine Army
Tristan Hoag
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:12 pm 
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Hello everyone;

I am new to Epic, and I am starting with a Space Marine force.  I am planning out my starting army list, and was hoping to get some ideas/thoughts regarding the forces I have, and how best to fight with them.  (I am not sure which armies I will be fighting against, so I am trying to think generically.)  

***  Disclaimer   ***
I do not currently own any aerospace units (Thunderhawks, Landing craft, drop pods, spacecraft, etc.), so I am attempting to make the best I can of a mud marine list! I will eventually purchase some of these units, but I am working  with what I have for now...  :cool:
*** /Disclaimer  ***

Here's the list as I see it now -

Tactical Detachment w/ Rhinos, Hunter, 2 Dread, Vindicator  - 550 pts.
Tactical Detachment w/ Rhinos, Hunter, Dread, Vindicator  - 500 pts.
Tactical Detachment w/ Rhinos, Hunter, Supreme Commander  - 475 pts.
Tactical Detachment w/ Rhinos, Hunter  - 375 pts.

Devastator Detachment w/ Rhinos, Hunter -325 pts.
Devastator Detachment w/ Rhinos, Hunter -325 pts.

Landraiders, Commander - 450 pts.

Total: 3,000 points

I also have available a few more Tactical formations, a few more Devastator formations, an Assault formation, a Predator formation (Annihilators), more Landraiders, and a Warlord Titan.

My thought is to run a Hammer-and-Anvil strategy, with the large Tactical formations and Devastators as the anvil, the Land Raiders and two mobile Tactical formations as the hammer.  I placed the SC with a mobile Tactical formation to avoid his being in the largest unit, but still in a large enough formation not to be an easy target.

As I am new to Epic, I expect that there are many things that I have not considered.  What kind of advice can you give me? Anything will be appreciated!

Tristan

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Dwarf Supreme
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:21 pm 
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Welcome to TacComm, the epicenter of the 6mm universe. I think I said hello to you on the SG forum, but in case I didn't, it's always good to see a fellow New Englander.  :cool:

I haven't played Marines yet for E:A, so I don't have any advice.

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Tristan Hoag
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:34 pm 
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To Dwarf Supreme -

Hi again!  I do remember you from the SG site...  Vermont is not too far from Connecticut...  meybe we will ru into each other at a tournament or something (if there are any in the area...)

Tristan

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nealhunt
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:35 pm 
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First, I strongly recommend you check out the threads of the most common adjustments to the SM list.  Many of them will help a great deal in making a ground pounder force work, especially the armor.

No point in putting both Rhinos and Dreads in a single formation.  That slows it down and keeps if from garrisoning.

You might be a bit heavy on Hunters, depending what people in your area like to do with aircraft.

Cut the Rhinos from a Dev formation and move the Dreads to them.  You can garrison with _1_ unit that can move more than 15cm, so keep the Hunter.  Garrison them.

Put your Vindis with the LRs instead of the infantry.  They bulk the formation, which is quite important for SM armor.  The difference in speed is small (identical if you use the proposed +5cm mod for Vindis) and the LRs need to be in 30cm to optimize their firepower anyway.  Against light fire, the LRs can go out front to shield the Vindis.  Against heavy firepower, the Vindis can be out front to soak hits that would take out the more expensive LRs.

Alternately, go with Preds/Vindis.  With the +5cm move on the Vindis and allowing armor formations to have Hunters, I've found 4 Annihilators, 2 Vindi, 1 Hunter to be a solid, AT-heavy formation.

You're a little light on activations but with the model selection you listed I'm not sure I know what you could do about it.  I find that Bike and Speeder formations are a staple of SM ground forces.  They are fast, reasonably durable, and provide flexibility by boosting activations.  Also, Terminators provide a reasonably priced heavy hitter.  Obviously, if you don't have the models, you don't have the models.

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Tristan Hoag
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:48 pm 
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Hi Neal;

Thanks for the advice!

I have been reading the lists - it has been a very eye-opening experience, to say the least!  Epic SM's are nothing like 40K SM's! (In a manner of speaking, that is...)

One question - What is Garrisoning?  :blush:

I agree about the Rhinos in the Dread formations - I had added them as blast marker dumps...  I was unaware of any disadvantage.

Not sure about the hunters - I don't know how prevalent air power is locally, but I figured that if I don't have any myself, I wanted to be protected, and they increase the unit size.

I will take your advice regarding the Vindicators - I wasn't sure about adding them to the Landraiders, with the speed difference, but I guess this army isn't going to be moving fast enough for that to be too much of a disadvantage.

As for what units to add to the list...  well, that will be another thread! :D

Thanks for the advice!

Tristan

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Tristan Hoag
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:53 pm 
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If I were to drop the Landraiders for the Predators, and transfer the Vindicators to that unit, and then drop a few hunters from some of the other squads, I could add in the Assault formation, which would bring me up to 8 activations....

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Dwarf Supreme
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:56 pm 
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(Tristan Hoag @ Jun. 28 2007,16:34)
QUOTE
To Dwarf Supreme -

Hi again! ?I do remember you from the SG site... ?Vermont is not too far from Connecticut... ?meybe we will ru into each other at a tournament or something (if there are any in the area...)

Tristan

I hope so. There might be one in Albany Columbus Day weekend. Just out of curiosity, how long would it take you to drive to Holyoke, Mass? There's a GW store there.

Sorry for the threadjacking. Your regular programming will now resume.  :D

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Tristan Hoag
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 10:08 pm 
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The good news....

Holyoke is about 2.5 hours...  I have been to the store.  :)

The bad news....

I was there about a month ago, and the store has been closed and replaced with a sunglasses shop!  (I was disappointed - I had gone that far because I needed some paints!)  :(

We should be able to work something out, though!

Tristan

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nealhunt
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 10:16 pm 
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(Tristan Hoag @ Jun. 28 2007,21:48)
QUOTE
One question - What is Garrisoning?  :blush:

Garrisoning is an option in the deployment rules for the GT scenario.  Details are in the scenario rules, but basically it allows you to set up outside the normal 15cm deployment zone as long as at least one unit in the formation is within 15cm of an objective (on your board half).

There are 3 ways to qualify to be allowed to garrison.  The one relevant to your force is no more than one unit with greater than 15cm move.  Infantry with Dreads and a Hunter qualify (only the Hunter moves faster than 15cm) as long as you don't take Rhinos.

If I were to drop the Landraiders for the Predators, and transfer the Vindicators to that unit, and then drop a few hunters from some of the other squads, I could add in the Assault formation,

I think that sounds pretty good.  LR-Pred exchange is 100 points, so you only need to drop 1 Hunter to get the 175 needed.  Also, if you dop the odd Dreadnought, you would have 50 points for a Chaplain in the Assault Marine formation, which will be very handy.

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Tristan Hoag
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 10:20 pm 
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Thanks again, Neal!

I am signing off for the night (I only have internet access at work..) but I will be around again to comment tomorrow.

Tristan

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 12:19 am 
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A word of warning:

If you're taking a predator-based ground formation... expect it to dish out a moderate ammount of firepower, but wilt like a dead flower the first time an enemy formation opens fire on it.

The formation size is small, and their armour is paper-thin.

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Bombot
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 12:47 am 
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I say only use Predators if you've got a reasonably high number of activiations.  Then you can move them towards the end of the turn and blast the hell out of something that might shoot back, then once you hopefully win the initiative in the next turn, blast the hell out of something else that might shoot back.

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netepic
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 6:40 am 
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I wrote a space marine tactica that might be of interest - though it doesn't take into account any of the proposed changes.

Incoming #23

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Legion 4
 Post subject: First Space Marine Army
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 7:04 am 
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Fight Combined Arms ...

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