Login |  Register |  FAQ
   
Post new topic Reply to topic  Page 3 of 3
  [ 45 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3

Drones
CyberShadow
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 10:24 pm 
Swarm Tyrant
Swarm Tyrant
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:22 pm
Posts: 9350
Location: Singapore

(nealhunt @ Apr. 13 2007,15:12)
QUOTE
Any hit which would be allocated to a Tau Infantry or battlesuit unit (Crisis, Stealth, or Broadside) may be allocated to a Drone unit instead, subject to the normal restrictions on allocating multiple hits."

Since Crisis and Stealths are infantry, only Broadsides are affected here.

_________________
https://www.cybershadow.ninja - A brief look into my twisted world, including wargames and beyond.
https://www.net-armageddon.org - The official NetEA (Epic Armageddon) site and resource.
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 4:00 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 4:45 pm
Posts: 8139
Location: London
Oh no, this would affect my tank army of doom :)

_________________
If using E-Bay use this link to support Tac Com!
'Abolish red trousers?! Never! Red trousers are France!' – Eugene Etienne, War Minister, 1913
"Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography."
General Plumer, 191x
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
CyberShadow
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 3:32 pm 
Swarm Tyrant
Swarm Tyrant
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:22 pm
Posts: 9350
Location: Singapore
OK, a brief round up of where we are right now...

Previous Drone rules consisted broadly of three aspects:

- blast markers and assault combat resolution (the Grot rule)
- drones protecting other units
- drones dont prevent garrison, etc

However, there seems to be a feeling that Drones should not be able to shield tanks - effectively making them a shield for infantry and battlesuits. It is also felt that the rules should be simplified, even where this would change the effect to make the explanation simpler.

Is this correct so far?

If so, it seems that we are actually heading towards the 'Grot' rule with an additional note about how Drones dont prevent a formation from garrisoning.

The effects of this would be:

- no blast markers due to destroyed drone units, rather than half blast markers (+)

- the only non-infantry unit affected is the Broadside, and this has 'drone protection' built in to its armour stat (-)

- it makes it clearer that drones only afford this protection if they are at the front under the usual targetting rules (+)

- no messing about with 'if the unit contains drones and non infantry units...' or 'pure drone units are still only affected by AP shots' (+)

The drone rule then becomes:

Formations that include at least one other Tau unit don?t receive Blast markers for Drone units that are killed, and don?t count Drone units that are lost in an assault when working out who has won the combat. Drone units do not disallow garrisoning at setup if the formation would otherwise be able to do so.


Comments?

_________________
https://www.cybershadow.ninja - A brief look into my twisted world, including wargames and beyond.
https://www.net-armageddon.org - The official NetEA (Epic Armageddon) site and resource.
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Moscovian
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 3:56 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 6:32 pm
Posts: 6414
Location: Allentown, Pennsylvania USA
If could shorten even further...

Formations that include at least one other Tau unit don?t receive Blast markers for Drone units that are killed, and don?t count Drone units that are lost in an assault when working out who has won the combat. Drone units do not disallow garrisoning.


And if you wanted to make drones function consistently through the army (in relation to not accumulating BMs)...

Formations don?t receive Blast markers for Drone units that are killed, and don?t count Drone units that are lost in an assault when working out who has won the combat. Drone units do not disallow garrisoning.

I'd be fine with any of them, but the last suggestion IMO makes things more consistent and easier to understand, not to mention is a shorter block of text.  Nobody has commented on this... Does the idea stink that bad? ???

_________________
author of Syncing Forward and other stories...

It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
nealhunt
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:04 pm 
Purestrain
Purestrain

Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 10:52 pm
Posts: 9617
Location: Nashville, TN, USA
Not counting lost drones in assault resolution was a problem, which is why it was removed.  Even at the original Drone rule of 50% BMs/casualties, it made Tau good at assaults even with moderate FF values.

Just for reference, in crunching the numbers way back during playtesting, Grots were each worth roughly +0.5 in the assault resolution.  That also had a lot of assumptions built into it about how Grots actually "block" other CC specialist units (Boyz and Nobz) from reaching base contact (in order to guarantee the hits were allocated to Grotz).  With FF-oriented troops that number would be higher.

Basically, that means that the Drone upgrade will give a Tau formation somewhere in the ballpark of +2.5 in its first assault.  If they win, some of the Drones will likely survive and boost later assaults as well.

I think that will strongly encourage offensive assaults.  It would definitely be extremely difficult to resist at only 75 points.  75 points for the equivalent of 2x Inspiring, even if it's disposable, is a steal.

IMHO, Drones should count for assault resolution like Daemons.  Leave that trait for Grots.

===

I like the idea of just making the Broadsides very tough.  Gun Drones would still be effective as additional screening for the formation because they would still be able to absorb AP and MW hits.  It's not as good as straight infantry but it should work.

_________________
Neal
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
nealhunt
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:07 pm 
Purestrain
Purestrain

Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 10:52 pm
Posts: 9617
Location: Nashville, TN, USA
Mosc:  That won't work.  Drones' ranged fire isn't enough better than their FF to discourage assaults to the same extent other Tau units are.  With that rule Drone formations would never gain BMs and virtually always have +2 assault mods from BMs.  I think their primary role would quickly become initiating assaults simply to gain support fire from other formations, i.e. token assaults.

_________________
Neal
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Moscovian
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:55 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 6:32 pm
Posts: 6414
Location: Allentown, Pennsylvania USA
I didn't think it through - you're right.  DANG!

Well, then the idea of having the casualties count in assaults is all right with me.  Drones would still be a steal at 75 points AND the special rule would be even smaller...

Formations that include at least one other Tau unit don?t receive Blast markers for Drone units that are killed. Drone units do not disallow garrisoning.
 That is certainly short enough to place at the bottom of the unit stat box and eliminate the need to have it at the top of the list.

_________________
author of Syncing Forward and other stories...

It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
CyberShadow
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 5:21 pm 
Swarm Tyrant
Swarm Tyrant
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:22 pm
Posts: 9350
Location: Singapore
Point taken. So, a revision... (as Moscovian has already said)

Formations that include at least one other Tau unit don?t receive Blast markers for Drone units that are killed. Drone units do not disallow garrisoning at setup if the formation would otherwise be able to do so.


This gets shorter and shorter. Soon, we will just have 'Drones... cool'.  :p

Have we gone too far and lost some of the flavour?

_________________
https://www.cybershadow.ninja - A brief look into my twisted world, including wargames and beyond.
https://www.net-armageddon.org - The official NetEA (Epic Armageddon) site and resource.
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Moscovian
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 5:26 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 6:32 pm
Posts: 6414
Location: Allentown, Pennsylvania USA
CS, the Tau list still has plenty of flavor :) .  Trust me.  Your recent moves will undoubtedly clean the list up and make it more palatable for newcomers as well.

_________________
author of Syncing Forward and other stories...

It's a dog-eat-dog world, and I've got my Milkbone underwear on.
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
CyberShadow
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 9:54 am 
Swarm Tyrant
Swarm Tyrant
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:22 pm
Posts: 9350
Location: Singapore
Formations that include at least one other Tau unit don?t receive Blast markers for Drone units that are killed. Drone units do not disallow garrisoning at setup if the formation would otherwise be able to do so.


Going once... Going twice...

_________________
https://www.cybershadow.ninja - A brief look into my twisted world, including wargames and beyond.
https://www.net-armageddon.org - The official NetEA (Epic Armageddon) site and resource.
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 9:59 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 4:45 pm
Posts: 8139
Location: London
Drones.... cool :)

I like it. Whats the next special rule to fall? :)

And when do we argue about tigersharks?  :D

Will this require revisting the points?

_________________
If using E-Bay use this link to support Tac Com!
'Abolish red trousers?! Never! Red trousers are France!' – Eugene Etienne, War Minister, 1913
"Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography."
General Plumer, 191x
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
colonel_sponsz
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 10:12 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2005 6:14 pm
Posts: 390
Minor point:  Change the "don't" to "do not".  It reads better in rules.

Orde

_________________
"I'm smelling a whole lot of 'if' coming off this plan."

Tau Army List Archive
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
CyberShadow
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 2:50 pm 
Swarm Tyrant
Swarm Tyrant
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:22 pm
Posts: 9350
Location: Singapore

(The_Real_Chris @ Apr. 18 2007,09:59)
QUOTE
And when do we argue about tigersharks?

I have scheduled another TigerShark 15-pager just following the Broadside infantry/light vehicle debate.  :D

_________________
https://www.cybershadow.ninja - A brief look into my twisted world, including wargames and beyond.
https://www.net-armageddon.org - The official NetEA (Epic Armageddon) site and resource.
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Drones
PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 3:01 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 4:45 pm
Posts: 8139
Location: London
Can I have pages 3-9?

On the plus side everyone seems to like the drones rule. I do wonder if it affects the points though. Are they still worth it? canna say as I only ever used them to shield tanks.

_________________
If using E-Bay use this link to support Tac Com!
'Abolish red trousers?! Never! Red trousers are France!' – Eugene Etienne, War Minister, 1913
"Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography."
General Plumer, 191x
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
  Print view Previous topic | Next topic 
Post new topic Reply to topic  Page 3 of 3
  [ 45 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


Powered by phpBB ® Forum Software © phpBB Group
CoDFaction Style by Daniel St. Jules of Gamexe.net