Login |  Register |  FAQ
   
Post new topic Reply to topic  Page 1 of 2
  [ 24 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

Modular Weapons costs 2.2
Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 7:03 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire
So, with the resurgance of interest I've put together a little update, largely to remove the 'one-gun' option that was so hastily added previously.  :D

Latest Version:
Version 2.2


Changes since Version 2.1:

- One-gun options are gone, you now must fill all available arm & carapace slots with something. (Suggestions for points cost for 'blank' carapace slots are welcome).

- Devotional Bell went up from 50 points to 225. Just a minor increase there. :D

- Dropped the number of FF attacks on the lasburner by one.


That's it I think.

Have at it. :)




_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Chroma
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 7:11 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:06 pm
Posts: 9684
Location: Montréal, QC, Canada
Your link still seems to go to the v2.11 version...

_________________
"EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer

Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 7:14 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire
Yes, yes it did. :)

Fixed.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Dwarf Supreme
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 8:32 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 8:45 pm
Posts: 11149
Location: Canton, CT, USA
For some reason it won't download. E&C, would you mind emailing the file (not just the link) to me?

EDIT Despite naysayers, I'm all for what you're trying to do.




_________________
"I don't believe in destiny or the guiding hand of fate." N. Peart
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 8:54 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire
Email sent.

For some reason some people have issues connecting to fileplanet, I'm not sure why.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Dwarf Supreme
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2007 9:04 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 8:45 pm
Posts: 11149
Location: Canton, CT, USA
I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one. I was beginning to develop a complex.  :laugh:

_________________
"I don't believe in destiny or the guiding hand of fate." N. Peart
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Chroma
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2007 4:43 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:06 pm
Posts: 9684
Location: Montréal, QC, Canada
BTW, thanks for the rapid update E&C!

_________________
"EPIC: Total War" Lead Developer

Now living in Boston... any EPIC players want to meet up?
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
nealhunt
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2007 7:24 pm 
Purestrain
Purestrain

Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 10:52 pm
Posts: 9617
Location: Nashville, TN, USA
It's been a while since I looked at these or followed the discussion, so forgive me if this has been covered.  I don't understand the costs of the head slots.

It's pretty widely agreed that FF is more valuable than CC.  Why is a CC head the same cost as a FF head for the same number of attacks?  I might understand for a Warlord that has a better CC, but the Reaver has the same for both.

Also, the FF head is 50 points for +2EA.  The Corvus gives double the number of attacks, plus it also gives the transport capacity.  It crams a lot more into a limited slot.  It seems like it should have not only roughly the same cost per shot, but also a premium for both the transport capacity and the more efficient use of a weapon slot.

===

I'm also pretty curious about the barrage weapons.  What are your assumptions in assigning point costs?  The effectiveness of 2 barrage weapons doesn't double firepower like it does for, say, 2 Turbolasers.  Obviously, you have to point them for an optimized configuration.  I'm just wondering what that might be and how the CLP/Fire Control heads factor into that.

===

The point is for use with other imperial armies, correct?

I think it would be okay if you diverged slightly from the resulting point cost for the "stock" titan weapons.  In other words, a Warlord titan with 2 Turbolasers, a Gatling and a Volcano wouldn't necessarily need to be exactly 850 points.  A variance of 10-20 points from the book values is really inconsequential if you are really trying to dial in balanced values.

Just as an example, if the Volcano Cannon on the Warlord is 105 because you want to match the book values, but 125 might result in better balance, just change it.

_________________
Neal
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
NOVAGUARD
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2007 7:52 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:37 pm
Posts: 406
humm.... i would definately be intrested in 'blank' costs...
iv several nightgaunts that would need upgunning... :(

_________________
Legio Nova guard: Finished
legio Storm lords: built
legio warp runners: un built
skitari: built
Eldar: in boxes
Orks: built, gargants painted
Ultra marines: 5 companies
Thousand sones: 5 companies (unpainted)
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2007 10:17 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire
It's pretty widely agreed that FF is more valuable than CC.  Why is a CC head the same cost as a FF head for the same number of attacks?  I might understand for a Warlord that has a better CC, but the Reaver has the same for both.


Nearly all costs (Some have subsequently been modified) are transferred from NetEpic's costs, where apparently the head variants cost the same. :)

I think you're right that they could be looked at.


I'm also pretty curious about the barrage weapons.  What are your assumptions in assigning point costs?  The effectiveness of 2 barrage weapons doesn't double firepower like it does for, say, 2 Turbolasers.  Obviously, you have to point them for an optimized configuration.  I'm just wondering what that might be and how the CLP/Fire Control heads factor into that.

The initial cost for the barrage weapons was found from the Reaver Titan's missile launcher (As part of the standard configuration loadout, it wasn't too hard to find the cost of the missile launcher).

So, the first assumption that was made was that NetEpic has balanced points costs for Turbolasers & Rocket Launchers (At least balanced versus each other in relative terms).

The fire control head & CLP were more contraversial, and are currently just a 'best guess' due to their different methods of operation from NetEpic. I've tested them a couple of times, but havn't delved into indirect titans in any big way, so I can't really say any more other than that the CLP & Fire Control Head have been priced with the assumption in mind that such a titan will have maxed out on Barrage weapons, and thus the cost of the upgrades needs to assume that the titan is going to have a *very* potent barrage ability, and thus the indirect ability is going to be of great value to the upgraded titan.

So essentially, I've assumed that noone will be taking a single missile launcher on a Warlord Titan, and then adding a Fire Control Head.


The point is for use with other imperial armies, correct?

I think it would be okay if you diverged slightly from the resulting point cost for the "stock" titan weapons.  In other words, a Warlord titan with 2 Turbolasers, a Gatling and a Volcano wouldn't necessarily need to be exactly 850 points.  A variance of 10-20 points from the book values is really inconsequential if you are really trying to dial in balanced values.

Just as an example, if the Volcano Cannon on the Warlord is 105 because you want to match the book values, but 125 might result in better balance, just change it.

I agree, where nessesary points costs should be ajusted to account for cheap synergies.

The basic 'hull' cost can always be nudged if nessesary in order to maintain the 250/650/850 pts costs of the standard configurations.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2007 10:25 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire

(NOVAGUARD @ Apr. 04 2007,19:52)
QUOTE
humm.... i would definately be intrested in 'blank' costs...
iv several nightgaunts that would need upgunning... :(

0-1 Empty Hardpoint.

25pts?

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Ilushia
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 3:16 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 10:50 am
Posts: 1189
If you're going to charge for empty hard points, why not just increase the base cost of the Titan by an amount equal to the number of hard points it has and drop all weapon costs by the price you would charge for a hard point. In this case Warhounds go up 50, Warlords go up 100 and Reavers go up 75. That'd give you the same effect without the weird "Here's a base price for a titan. Now here's what we charge you for not taking a weapon" situation.
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Soren
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 9:28 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother

Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 9:42 am
Posts: 694
Location: Austria
I strongly suggest to round const numbers to near multiples of 25. In most cases their are only minor tweaks to do, but makes usage of the list much easier. Don?t think the impact will be that much if a Weapon cost is dropped from 80 to 75 or raised from 120 to 125. As most of the costs are suggestions, I would strongly recommend this to keep things a bit more simple.

_________________
Attrition is the proof of absence of Strategy
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
ragnarok
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 10:12 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2005 2:43 pm
Posts: 2084
Location: Reading, England
Two questions.

1) Why did the devotional bell go up by so much?

2) did you intend for warhounds to be still able to only take one weapon?

EDIT:  An idea for blank slots (for the carapace).  What about extra flak guns, or void shield generators?




_________________
Tyranid air marshal
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Modular Weapons costs 2.2
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 10:49 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire

(Ilushia @ Apr. 05 2007,03:16)
QUOTE
If you're going to charge for empty hard points, why not just increase the base cost of the Titan by an amount equal to the number of hard points it has and drop all weapon costs by the price you would charge for a hard point. In this case Warhounds go up 50, Warlords go up 100 and Reavers go up 75. That'd give you the same effect without the weird "Here's a base price for a titan. Now here's what we charge you for not taking a weapon" situation.

Because most people won't want an empty 4th hardpoint...

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter
Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
  Print view Previous topic | Next topic 
Post new topic Reply to topic  Page 1 of 2
  [ 24 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


Powered by phpBB ® Forum Software © phpBB Group
CoDFaction Style by Daniel St. Jules of Gamexe.net