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SM and IG working together?
Legion 4
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 6:00 am 
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Guys, All the SM1 Off-Board Support was great !  Barrages, Haywire, Vortex, etc., we still use them !  Your technique is a good one for using allies, Tom. And that should work with any rule system.

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primarch
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 3:26 pm 
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Hi!

Yes, they were! Haywire ws most fun!

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Legion 4
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 5:29 pm 
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WMD with EMP ! }:)  Fried circuits, anyone ! :;):  FFfzzzzap !

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primarch
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2004 1:09 am 
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Hi!

It was cheesy though when you started using titans with the "relay" ability though.....

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Legion 4
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2004 3:30 am 
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Relay rule was weak ... we never used it in it's out-of-the-book form and dropped it, IIRC ! :;):

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primarch
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2004 4:16 am 
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Hi!

I used it once, smelled the cheddar and never used it again.....

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QuintAan
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 1:21 pm 
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I've got a 4000 pt game versus an eldar opponent. This is actually going to be a rematch as we played last week at 4K pts and tied, 1 goal to 0 in my favour. So the list here is much the same with a few changes I want to try.

Its made using v3.4 of the Chaos List with a couple nods to the stated changes Pixelgeek is thinking of putting in.

Infantry Platoon (8 marines) with 2 obliterators, icon
= 480 pts

Infantry Platoon (8 marines) with 4 havocs, icon
= 480 pts

Scout Detachment (4 scout marines) with 2 rhinos
= 170 pts

Scout Detachment (4 scout marines) with 2 rhinos
= 170 pts

Armoured Detachment of 4 Predators, 1 Land Raider
= 275 pts

Armoured Detachment of 4 Predators, 1 Land Raider
= 275 pts

Strike Detachment of 4 Chosen Terminators
= 260 pts

Strike Detachment of 4 Raptors
= 140 pts

Cavalry Detachment of 8 Bikes
= 300 pts

Reserve Detachment of Decimator, 3 Defilers
= 450 pts

Assault Company of 2 Deathwheels
= 550 pts

Air Support Formation of 3 Hellblades (actually swiftdeaths but I like the idea of the hellblade much better)
= 200 pts

Air Support Formation of 2 Helltalons
= 200 pts

== 4000 pts

The Chaos Warlord would most likely be the chaos lord of the raptors.

Comments are welcome keeping in mind one main restriction from the background of my Chaos Legion: I cannot and will not take anything dedicated to a chaos god other than chaos undivided. So don't bother with suggestions of Cult Marines or greater daemons.
:;):
Cheers!

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pixelgeek
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 6:07 pm 
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I'd remove the aircraft entirely. They are useless against Eldar.


I'd beef up the Raptors a bit. Currently its a small formation and will break easily. I'd also give them some Sacrifices. As I would also do with the Chosen.

I'd take the Defilers from the Decimator formations. Its too easy for your opponent to add BMs and break the Decimator by shooting the Defilers.

If you have the extra points from the aircraft I'd suggest adding a formation of Land Raiders and perhaps adding a Daemon prince to the Chosen (he can be Undivded)

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QuintAan
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 6:38 pm 
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Re: aircraft - how do you deal with the threat of Eldar aircraft? I.e. how many obilterators?

Re: Raptors - Yeah, I got to get more stands of them. :/

Thanks for the suggestions.

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pixelgeek
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 8:04 pm 
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Quote (QuintAan @ 08 2005 July,10:38)
Re: aircraft - how do you deal with the threat of Eldar aircraft? I.e. how many obilterators?

I don't really worry aabout their aircraft that much. I don't worry about aircraft in general. CSM units have good armour and can get in cover fairly easy making most aircraft less of a threat.

What I would be more concerned with are Nightspinners and any Disrupt weapons the Eldar have. Disrupt can really ruin your day. I'd suggest putting your armour formations on "Nightspinner" hunting duty if he brings any

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QuintAan
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 8:10 pm 
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He usually fields two detachments of Nightspinners, and I have been prompted in mid game to declare my hatred of them. :D
Cheers!

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Jaldon
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 9:49 am 
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Location: Utah, pick a Pacific Island the other half of the year.
I'd drop a Scout, get one more Chosen, and an Obl in the Chosen formation, then teleport the whole bunch near one of the VS formations. If it gets in ouch!

Otherwise PG's suggestions are good, and he is correct about A/C as they pertain to effectiveness against CSM. Dis weapons are a bigger threat.

Jaldon

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Clockwerks
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 7:40 pm 
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Mua ha ha ha! Prepare for the end, Bill!

Actually I don't know what all the hype is about Eldar Aircraft, to be honest. Mine suck, I usually get them blown sky high (no pun intended) before they do anything worthwhile... But then of course I seldom excercise any control when it comes to juicy units like that. :p

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 7:33 am 
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I'm out of touch with the CSM development but if you can do it max out on individual decimators (those warengines with the 3BP, MW, Ignore Cover guns) and use the experimental artillary rules (i.e MW fire uses the AP table for all targets).
They will push up your activations, make up for the fact you have decided to forgo the free fearless troops (well, slightly make it for their lack) and slaughter most eldar infantry and vehicles with the barrage MW attack. Happily double everywhere until you get a chance to sustain and if you break strongly consider going towards the enemy (unless you are near death in which case go and hide :) ).

Interesting list incidentally. It raises the question of whether an undivided black legion should be as good as one with cult marines.

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Irondeath
 Post subject: SM and IG working together?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:03 pm 
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Chris, that option is no longer as appealing. 3.5 changes, taken from Zac?s blog:

Changes include

Limit of four upgrades per formation

CSM Retinue down to 8 CSM units

Cult Marines now an upgrade

0-2 limit on Assault Co

Forlorn Hope only CSM units

Price decrease for CSM Retinue

Summoning Changes (extensive and based on Neal and Audrey's Daemon Pack rules)

Helltalon now 2BP with no Ignore Cover

Critical Changes to Titans

Strategy roll of 6 adds 1D3 daemons, roll of 1 loses 1D6 daemons

IB no longer Inspiring

Champion now 2D3 Augment Summoning

Daemon Prince is now Fearless

Limit of one GD per faction on the table at any one time


So a maximum of 2 lone Decimators.

No "Free Fearless" troops.

Retinue price decrease is 280->275 points.

Helltalons at 300 w/o Ignore Cover

Summoning, when it is resolved, will definitely be more exepensive than before, by a factor of 2x or 3x IMO.

All said and done, yours and others concerns are taken seriously and the problems are adressed.


As to Eldar Aircraft: I witnessed a major air brawl lately, 2xNightwings vs. hordes of Fighta-Bommers (12?), and the orks good slaughtered badly. Total carnage. Nothing wrong with that, just my impression that the power of Eldar air should not be underestimated.

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