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3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe

 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 7:52 pm 
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Rules used:
 Neal's changedocs (Handbook 2008)
 CAP can use against Intercept/Executed CAP
 Flyers cannot contest objectives on the turn they land


Emperor's Children "2.1" "Death From Above"

I wanted to try something different. Dreadclaw army with no Daemon Knights...


Chosen + Dreadclaws + Pact         555 (bts)
Retinue + Dreadclaws + Pact         380
 (Daemon Prince, 4 Possessed, 1 Noise)
Retinue + Rhinos + Pact                 330
Legionnaires + Dreadclaws + Pact  170
Legionnaires + Dreadclaws + Pact  170
Bike Company + Pact  (SC)             350
Questor                                           275
Hell Blades                                      200
Hell Talons                                      200
Devastation                                    150
Daemon Pool: 11 Lesser Daemon  220

Points as in EC thread. Hell Blade as 2x 30cm 4+/6+/+6, no sv
Hell Talon as 1x 30cm AT4+/AA4+, 45cm AP4+, 15cm 1BP IC, sv 5+



Eldar Ulthwe  "Flying Circus"

No titans, but many flyers.



Swords (4 Falcon, 1 Firestorm)
Swords (4 Falcon, 1 Firestorm)
Shields (3 Night Spinner)
Scorpion
Guardians with Heavy and Support
Vampire with Guardians
Black Guardians with Wave Serpents (bts)
Swooping Hawks (teleport)
Night Wings
Phoenix Bombers
+ Gate and Avatar


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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 7:55 pm 
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SETUP

We rolled d6+SR to determine who setups first. EC wins and decides for corner deployment and first placement of objectives. After all objectives were set, EC announces full carnage: Devastation is to arrive on the first turn.

No garrisons. EC deploys 3 formations, Eldar 5. In reserve: 4 formations of Dreadclaw EC marines, Eldar Guardians and Swooping Hawks.


(blitz objectives are just out of picture on far left and right edge, about half way the table)


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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:05 pm 
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TURN 1

No teleports. Initiative: Eldar

Eldar Phoenix Bombers swoop down on EC Retinue but they have stone hard armor and only one Rhino is lost - enough to slow them down, however.

Then the Chaos Spaceship arrives. The red beam comes down from the sky and penetrates a big hole in Scorpion. It barely survives and redeploys to middle of the battlefield.

Then the bombs fall and destroy Fire Storm from the Eldar right flank.

Then down comes the Dreadclaws. Chosen and first Legionnaires drop quite close to Eldar blitz and the Dreadclaw fire breaks the Shields of Vaul which regroups to far left corner.
(rule question here: is the Dreadclaw/Drop Pod fire supposed to come from the ground level or from the sky? It is underlined that it attacks all enemy formations within 15cm, so this would indicate that it rains from the sky, but on the other hand the gun seems to be in model.. so which it is?)

Retinue (with Possessed) and other Legionnaires drop close to other Eldar Sword formation and Black Guardians. Swords are broken in Dreadclaw fire and they fall to hills on left flank.

Then Retinue calls for Daemon and retains and engages Black Guardians. In resulting fight all Black Guardians are wiped out - so much for the BTS. (8x3+ first strike + 5x3+ + 1x3+ TK is quite deadly). Chaos loses 2 Lesser Daemons.

So in total, after first Chaos activations, BTS is completely wiped and 3 other Eldar formations broken...

(to be continued, first some TV)


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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:38 pm 
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(Hena @ Jan. 31 2008,19:35)
QUOTE
So the answer is ground level fire. But it comes from several units.

All the attacks are measured from the "drop pod/deathwind" marker, no?

Are the Deathwind attacks subject to LOS?

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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:43 pm 
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Turn 1 continues...

No more exact markings. I think next the other Sword formation opens fire at Chosen (no kills) and doubles to far left corner. Then Questor doubles toward broken Swords and wipes them out.

Next Guardians appear from the Wraithgate, engage Legionnaires and while lose 3 units in engagement against 1 Legionnaire unit, they win by 3 and wipe them out. Guardians advance toward Retinue with Possessed. Other Legionnaires double toward Scorpion and shoot at it, wiping it. Vampire tries to execute ground attack but stands down (no more SC to help here).

Hell Blades ground attack Guardians neat Wrathgate and cause some blast markers and one lost unit. Nightwings intercept them but all hits are saved.

Other EC retinue tries to marshal but fails and holds. No more Eldar activations - Chosen double toward broken Shields and shoot and wipe them. Bikes march toward Guardians. Hell Talons bomb Guardians and break them.

Hm I guess that was all. Guardians fail to rally, other remove blast markers.

(final positions)

And casualty boxes...


One picture tells more than enough...


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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:46 pm 
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TURN 2

No teleports. Initiative: Eldar

Swords fail to activate. No SC.

EC Bikes summon some Lesser Daemon, engage broken Guardians and wipe them out.

Last try: Vampire Raider and Guardians assaults Chosen (bts). 2 Chosen are lost but Vampire and Guardians wiped out.

No much point continuing. Massacre can be ended.


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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:49 pm 
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*ouch*

I know it would've eaten up some activations, but I'm really surprised the Ulthwe player didn't use the triple activation advantage to get as many formations out of their deployment zone as possible... since it's highly likely that's there the drops are going to land!

Brutal, brutal fight.

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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:00 pm 
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(Chroma @ Jan. 31 2008,21:49)
QUOTE
I know it would've eaten up some activations, but I'm really surprised the Ulthwe player didn't use the triple activation advantage to get as many formations out of their deployment zone as possible... since it's highly likely that's there the drops are going to land!

We discussed about this but it would have meant that half the Eldar ground force would been located to middle of the board with no real action this turn. So, he decided to risk it.

The corner deployment of course helped Chaos here, as less space for the Eldar deployment, easier to hit with that 15cm repositioning of drops.


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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:01 pm 
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Ouch indeed...

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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:04 pm 
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(rpr @ Jan. 31 2008,20:00)
QUOTE
The corner deployment of course helped Chaos here, as less space for the Eldar deployment, easier to hit with that 15cm repositioning of drops.

But then you roll for scatter, correct?

It's been a while since I've used or faced a planetfalling army.

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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:05 pm 
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Aftermath:

We discussed about flyers, especially Eldar fliers, which are expensive (well namely Nightwings). "New" Chaos flyers seem okay - not too weak, most probably not too strong. I used those values for Hell Talons for the first time. Hell Blades could have sv 6+ on my opinion but that is quite small thing.

Ulthwe has this "problem" that BTS and SC are almost forced to be in the same formation unless titans are taken. A bit limiting I would say.

Possessed are EVIL - but only from drop pods and if they drop close. Otherwise...  And Daemon Prince is still so cheap thing, luckily EC can only take one of them, but LatD and Black Legion...

Legionnaires like Forlorn Hope - why not? At least not all were fearless.. better this than non-scout regular CSMs on my opinion, but if fluffwise it should be otherway around...

Non-fearless rhino: well the only one was lost via shooting so cannot comment about stranding issue - it would be anyway more of the problem of broken Retinue, right?


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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:10 pm 
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(Chroma @ Jan. 31 2008,22:04)
QUOTE

(rpr @ Jan. 31 2008,20:00)
QUOTE
The corner deployment of course helped Chaos here, as less space for the Eldar deployment, easier to hit with that 15cm repositioning of drops.

But then you roll for scatter, correct?

Yes, but as it is 7cm in average, it is not that hard to get stuff under the 15cm range - in my case, the initial drop points were like 10-20cm away from closest formations, which I then repositioned as close as possible, and after that with 6-8cm scatter the 15cm range would still hit at least 3-4 units.

Here is actually a question about execution order... we used following order:
1. pin-point
2. MW (preplotted)
3. repositioning of drop coordinates
4. handling each drop one by one (4.1 roll scatter 4.2 roll attacks 4.3 deploy units)

But phase 3 and 4 could be merged, i.e. relocate one, roll for scatter and attacks and deploy units, then reposition next etc.. Or it could be like 3, 4, 5, 6...

And yes the original question was: does drop pod need LOS from the center location to attacked units.






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 Post subject: 3k EC 2.1 vs Ulthwe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:15 pm 
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(rpr @ Jan. 31 2008,20:00)
QUOTE
We discussed about this but it would have meant that half the Eldar ground force would been located to middle of the board with no real action this turn. So, he decided to risk it.

So they wound up in the Dead Box with no real action this turn... *LAUGH*

Or, as the Seer Council probably said, "Didn't see that coming!"

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